Atheist guru PZ Myers gets religion

[Ronja]

For what it's worth: I saw PZ's blog post as at least partly humorous / tongue in cheek, and also as making some fun of himself. The comments seem to address quite well the point that there are many roads into atheism and many ways of being an atheist. So I don't get why this particular blog post would be such a big deal.

[Seth]

I got news for Myers, and he won't like it: Nothing necessarily follows from atheism, except for a rejection of faith as a substitute for whatever knowledge we can provisionally attain through evidence. The only inevitable result of this is a lack of belief in a god thingy. That's why we have communist, nihilist, humanist and libertarian atheists, among others. There are atheists who are pacifists, and those who are not. Atheists can be opposed to abortion or for it, for or against the death penalty. In fact, PZ, nowhere in your rant is there even a discernible hint as to what all atheists must necessarily have in common beside their rejection of faith-based knowledge leading to their lack of belief in a god, and even there we see differences. For instance, I regard myself as an agnostic atheist. Other atheists feel certain that there cannot be a god. This is not the first time where I got the impression that you have set your mouth in motion before putting your brain in gear.

(Link to Myers' article)

I don't think he's saying so much that they do, but that they should. He wants evangelical Atheism. He wants Atheism to have a social and political agenda. That's the point of my article. He wants to (unknowingly) turn atheism into Atheism and make a religion of it...as if such sects do not already exist.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I got news for Myers, and he won't like it: Nothing necessarily follows from atheism, except for a rejection of faith as a substitute for whatever knowledge we can provisionally attain through evidence. The only inevitable result of this is a lack of belief in a god thingy. That's why we have communist, nihilist, humanist and libertarian atheists, among others. There are atheists who are pacifists, and those who are not. Atheists can be opposed to abortion or for it, for or against the death penalty. In fact, PZ, nowhere in your rant is there even a discernible hint as to what all atheists must necessarily have in common beside their rejection of faith-based knowledge leading to their lack of belief in a god, and even there we see differences. For instance, I regard myself as an agnostic atheist. Other atheists feel certain that there cannot be a god. This is not the first time where I got the impression that you have set your mouth in motion before putting your brain in gear.

(Link to Myers' article)

I don't think he's saying so much that they do, but that they should. He wants evangelical Atheism. He wants Atheism to have a social and political agenda. That's the point of my article. He wants to (unknowingly) turn atheism into Atheism and make a religion of it...as if such sects do not already exist.

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

[Seth]

I got news for Myers, and he won't like it: Nothing necessarily follows from atheism, except for a rejection of faith as a substitute for whatever knowledge we can provisionally attain through evidence. The only inevitable result of this is a lack of belief in a god thingy. That's why we have communist, nihilist, humanist and libertarian atheists, among others. There are atheists who are pacifists, and those who are not. Atheists can be opposed to abortion or for it, for or against the death penalty. In fact, PZ, nowhere in your rant is there even a discernible hint as to what all atheists must necessarily have in common beside their rejection of faith-based knowledge leading to their lack of belief in a god, and even there we see differences. For instance, I regard myself as an agnostic atheist. Other atheists feel certain that there cannot be a god. This is not the first time where I got the impression that you have set your mouth in motion before putting your brain in gear.

(Link to Myers' article)

I don't think he's saying so much that they do, but that they should. He wants evangelical Atheism. He wants Atheism to have a social and political agenda. That's the point of my article. He wants to (unknowingly) turn atheism into Atheism and make a religion of it...as if such sects do not already exist.

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

"Herding cats" also comes to mind.

And therein lies the strength of religion. This appears to be something PZ is coming to understand. Without common cause and a common set of ideals and principles, it's extremely difficult to get people to act together effectively. Religion is the acknowledged master of such "community organizing" skills. And there's nothing wrong with that, unless you wrongly conflate religion and theism and throw out the baby with the bathwater. I've always felt atheists are their own worst enemies.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com ... t-atheism/

[HomerJay]

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

Mmm, tried that and by some bizarre coincidence the first hit is to a findarticles link to a letter in The Gazette (Colorado Springs), home to one Seth Richardson!

Whodathunkit?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22If+we+don%27t+a ... ly.%22&l=1

[Gawdzilla Sama]

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

Mmm, tried that and by some bizarre coincidence the first hit is to a findarticles link to a letter in The Gazette (Colorado Springs), home to one Seth Richardson!

Whodathunkit?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22If+we+don%27t+a ... ly.%22&l=1

Bit older than that, I do believe.

[Coito ergo sum]

The thing about this is - if atheism means more than "I don't believe in gods" - and if it has some principles other than that, then if I don't believe in gods, but also don't subscribe to those other principles, then I'm not an atheist. But, clearly I am.

Another thing is - somebody needs to list these other principles that atheists must adhere to in order to be atheists. What are they? Here - let's start the list - atheists believe the following:

1. There aren't any gods.
2. ?
3, ?
4. ?

So, what are they? I didn't get the memo, so if someone can help me out....

[Coito ergo sum]

I got news for Myers, and he won't like it: Nothing necessarily follows from atheism, except for a rejection of faith as a substitute for whatever knowledge we can provisionally attain through evidence. The only inevitable result of this is a lack of belief in a god thingy. That's why we have communist, nihilist, humanist and libertarian atheists, among others. There are atheists who are pacifists, and those who are not. Atheists can be opposed to abortion or for it, for or against the death penalty. In fact, PZ, nowhere in your rant is there even a discernible hint as to what all atheists must necessarily have in common beside their rejection of faith-based knowledge leading to their lack of belief in a god, and even there we see differences. For instance, I regard myself as an agnostic atheist. Other atheists feel certain that there cannot be a god. This is not the first time where I got the impression that you have set your mouth in motion before putting your brain in gear.

(Link to Myers' article)

I don't think he's saying so much that they do, but that they should. He wants evangelical Atheism. He wants Atheism to have a social and political agenda. That's the point of my article. He wants to (unknowingly) turn atheism into Atheism and make a religion of it...as if such sects do not already exist.

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

Some of us are hung better than others, of course.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

And some of us should be hung.

[Coito ergo sum]

And some of us should be hung.

Hanged?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

And some of us should be hung.

Hanged?

[Coito ergo sum]

And some of us should be hung.

Hanged?

That is a sentence fragment. Your grade is F!

[Seth]

"If we don't all hang together, we shall all hang separately." You can google that one.

Mmm, tried that and by some bizarre coincidence the first hit is to a findarticles link to a letter in The Gazette (Colorado Springs), home to one Seth Richardson!

Whodathunkit?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22If+we+don%27t+a ... ly.%22&l=1

Bit older than that, I do believe.

That is a remarkable coincidence, or not. It's a common quote from Benjamin Franklin after all, and the letter was from one Holmes Brannon, in 2006. Besides, I don't live in Colorado Springs.

[Coito ergo sum]

Repeat: somebody needs to list these other principles that atheists must adhere to in order to be atheists. What are they? Here - let's start the list - atheists believe the following:

1. There aren't any gods.
2. ?
3, ?

I'm about to conclude that atheism is just the belief that there are no gods, and nothing more. We've had the allegation in the OP that atheism is a "system" of beliefs. If the OP is true, then what are those beliefs?

Holding breath...turning blue....