The Jehova's have invited me...

[klr]

I remember someone i know answering the door to jehovah's witness in the morning with his meat out........accidentally i hope.

I actually talk to the jehovah's witness around here good for a laugh tell them i'm an atheist and talked about this doco i saw on SBS on them oddly interesting. Although i fundamentally disagree with their beliefs and have debated one of them in front of a class about evolution vs creationism debate they are essentially harmless fundies and at the end of the day there is no bullshit i mean there beliefs are but they are honest about it unlike the hillsong types and they have no bullshit prosperity theology crap. Have no real interest like other religions in forcing their beliefs on others and are essentially pacifists.

Take of it what you will. :-|

They do have an interest in letting people bleed to death though, including their own children - and themselves. That's no laughing matter.

It's not about bleeding to death or letting anyone bleed to death whilst i don't agree with forcing children to conform to their parents beliefs its actually helping with bloodless surgery so transfusion are lessen/not necessary because the blood stock are getting low in some types of blood and if they run out they wont have transfusions.

I can understand where you are coming from KLR but in a round about way its helping development of surgery techniques in a odd way.

Firstly, please try and use more punctuation in future.

Secondly, that reasoning completely stinks. Are you seriously trying to suggest that it is OK for parents to risk the death of their children for the very questionable greater good of bloodless surgery? What about the right of the child to get the best medical care available, only to have it denied because of their parents' religious beliefs, beliefs which have no connection with reality whatsoever? On that path lies madness. We fret and even protest at the prospect of animals being used for medical testing. Are you telling me that a child's life is worth any less?

Millions have had their lives saved by blood transfusions, and it's not going away any time soon.

Frankly speaking, your argument has more than a whiff of JW apologetics to it. I think you've been listening too much to the JW's, and not critically evaluating what they are actually saying. You might need to take a good, hard look at the JW's, and treat their BS on several fronts a lot more seriously.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

I remember someone i know answering the door to jehovah's witness in the morning with his meat out........accidentally i hope.

I actually talk to the jehovah's witness around here good for a laugh tell them i'm an atheist and talked about this doco i saw on SBS on them oddly interesting. Although i fundamentally disagree with their beliefs and have debated one of them in front of a class about evolution vs creationism debate they are essentially harmless fundies and at the end of the day there is no bullshit i mean there beliefs are but they are honest about it unlike the hillsong types and they have no bullshit prosperity theology crap. Have no real interest like other religions in forcing their beliefs on others and are essentially pacifists.

Take of it what you will. :-|

They do have an interest in letting people bleed to death though, including their own children - and themselves. That's no laughing matter.

It's not about bleeding to death or letting anyone bleed to death whilst i don't agree with forcing children to conform to their parents beliefs its actually helping with bloodless surgery so transfusion are lessen/not necessary because the blood stock are getting low in some types of blood and if they run out they wont have transfusions.

I can understand where you are coming from KLR but in a round about way its helping development of surgery techniques in a odd way.

I really can't go with that argument, red. You might as well say that we learnt a lot about human physiology and psychology by the experiments carried out in the Nazi concentration camps and Japanese POW camps in China, so that was a good thing in part. Or that the insight into the effects of radiation on human beings gained from the Hiroshima and Nagasaki blasts justified dropping the bombs.

The fact is that many children have died and many more will die in the future because of their fucked-up parents' religions - and not just JWs - there are fatalities caused by circumcisions too, and don't get me started on the fucking christian scientists! If you love your sky-fairy more than your children, you are a stupid cunt and don't deserve to keep those children.

I can see where your argument is coming from but I can't accept that non-invasive and keyhole surgical techniques are being developed simply in order to comply with the JWs fucked up 'faith', or even that that is a significant contributing reason for research into these techniques. The advantages of a decrease in recovery time (thus freeing much needed beds), higher survival rates, and less reliance on dwindling blood stocks are the factors that drive such development.

[maiforpeace]

I don't have that problem here. They've learned to walk past my house.

I live up a flight of 40 steps so they usually pass my house too.

Waste of fucking time. I detest religion in all its forms, particularly today as I'm sulking. Don't even breathe in the same air as they do, fucking parasites. Go for a walk somewhere where there aren't fuckers.

That's exactly what I was thinking. You must be awfully bored to consider boring yourself even more. How about joining your local atheist group instead and giving them some support?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Gawdzilla: Go away you old fart.

Tigger: Enjoy the argument polite debate.

http://www.truemetal.org/metalwallpaper ... rifice.jpg[/imgc]

[redunderthebed]

I remember someone i know answering the door to jehovah's witness in the morning with his meat out........accidentally i hope.

I actually talk to the jehovah's witness around here good for a laugh tell them i'm an atheist and talked about this doco i saw on SBS on them oddly interesting. Although i fundamentally disagree with their beliefs and have debated one of them in front of a class about evolution vs creationism debate they are essentially harmless fundies and at the end of the day there is no bullshit i mean there beliefs are but they are honest about it unlike the hillsong types and they have no bullshit prosperity theology crap. Have no real interest like other religions in forcing their beliefs on others and are essentially pacifists.

Take of it what you will. :-|

They do have an interest in letting people bleed to death though, including their own children - and themselves. That's no laughing matter.

It's not about bleeding to death or letting anyone bleed to death whilst i don't agree with forcing children to conform to their parents beliefs its actually helping with bloodless surgery so transfusion are lessen/not necessary because the blood stock are getting low in some types of blood and if they run out they wont have transfusions.

I can understand where you are coming from KLR but in a round about way its helping development of surgery techniques in a odd way.

Firstly, please try and use more punctuation in future.

Secondly, that reasoning completely stinks. Are you seriously trying to suggest that it is OK for parents to risk the death of their children for the very questionable greater good of bloodless surgery? What about the right of the child to get the best medical care available, only to have it denied because of their parents' religious beliefs, beliefs which have no connection with reality whatsoever? On that path lies madness. We fret and even protest at the prospect of animals being used for medical testing. Are you telling me that a child's life is worth any less?

Millions have had their lives saved by blood transfusions, and it's not going away any time soon.

Frankly speaking, your argument has argument have more than a whiff of JW apologetics to them. I think you've been listening too much to the JW's, and not critically evaluating what they are actually saying. You might need to take a good, hard look at the JW's, and treat their BS on several fronts a lot more seriously.

Firstly i'm stoned lack of punctuation is given.

Secondly i don't think the reasoning is good either, but it could serve a great purpose blood stocks are lessening and JV's and them or there parents refusing blood transfusions aren't going away either no matter what happens.Whilst i disagree with children being forced to have no blood transfusion, it's going to be a fact of life parents are your legal guardians until your 18 whether they are JV fundies or not and preaching to JV's what you say to a fair few of them wont make any difference you got to understand the mentality of them if they die because they are follow god's laws or whatever they'll go to heaven i fundamentally disagree with that but are we just going to let them die just because of our beliefs.I believe in tolerance of religion it isnt going away no matter how much we would like it.

Therefor catering for them and using the opportunity to develop alternative methods is a good idea like you said every child has the right to the best health care.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

If a child, whatever its parents' beliefs, is in need of surgery, medication, amputation, a blood transfusion, or any other medical procedure in order to save its life, it should be given that treatment and the law should ensure that that happens. End of!

The wishes of a parent or guardian should not come into the equation in such a case, just as they should not be considered if they decided that their 7 year old should be buggered by the father and his mates, or if they decided that the child should be sent to work in a sweat-shop at the age of 9. The legal guardian's right to make decisions on behalf of a child end when those decisions are detrimental to the well-being of that child.

If an adult JW decides to die rather than accept blood, that is a sad decision but ultimately it is that person's decision to make and many would say good riddance (I would stop short of that personally, except in jest, but I sympathise with those that do.) But that same JW cannot make that decision on behalf of another.

[Chinaski]

Sacrificing JW's for the benefit of the other people... Maybe Catholics... Or Born again's!! GASP! SAVE THEM SAVE THEM SAVE THEM!!!!