ence and Yahweh

[Blind groper]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... ce+News%29

The reference above is to the degree of neolithic violence that appears to have happened. However, as I read the reference, I thought about the Old Testament violence. On a number of occasions Yahweh directed the children of Isreal to massacre other peoples, but keep their young women for themselves. Of course, the children of Isreral of those times were neolithic, and no doubt very violent. The use of a fictional deity to provide a justification to do horrible things continues to this day.

[JimC]

Did you mean Science and Yahweh?

Or was it a misspelling of Ents and Yahweh, an interesting blend of Lord of the Rings and the Bible?



But yes, gods are always a useful way to spin rape, murder and pillage as Good Things...

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Jim! You're out of teh loopz, guy! ence and Yahweh are one of the most popular beat combos on the current scene! Their latest album - Totes Godballs - went octopussy platinum last Wednesdsay! Or some shit...

[Brian Peacock]

Where neolithic times actually beset by violence? Maybe it was a golden age of peace and love and the mass grave of mutilated corpse mentioned was an abnormal rarity? Isn't drawing a general conclusion from a tiny sample something archaeologists just publish on out of habit? Will the invention of the time machine finally put these questions to rest?

[Sean Hayden]

No, it will resurrect reality TV.

[Blind groper]

My apologies guys. My computer played a dirty trick on me. The title was supposed to be violence and Yahweh.

On Neolithic violence.
If you read Prof Steven Pinker, you will discover that the ancient societies had the worst violence of all.

[Hermit]

If you read Prof Steven Pinker, you will discover that the ancient societies had the worst violence of all.

Oh, Pinker is a Prof. That means he has access to medical records and scrupulously analysed empirical data to prove his thesis, right?

[JimC]

If you read Prof Steven Pinker, you will discover that the ancient societies had the worst violence of all.

Oh, Pinker is a Prof. That means he has access to medical records and scrupulously analysed empirical data to prove his thesis, right?

Actually, I've read the book by Pinker that BG is referring to (The better angels of our nature), and he does provide copious academic references to support his claims...

[Hermit]

If you read Prof Steven Pinker, you will discover that the ancient societies had the worst violence of all.

Oh, Pinker is a Prof. That means he has access to medical records and scrupulously analysed empirical data to prove his thesis, right?

Actually, I've read the book by Pinker that BG is referring to (The better angels of our nature), and he does provide copious academic references to support his claims...

Actually, I have read enough of his argument to notice that from an empirical stance those references are so spongy that they approach the domain of the meaningless.

By the way, I do agree with his thesis. My previous post was a piece of devil's advocacy prompted by Blind groper's implied appeal to authority. Not that I mind mention of an author's professional qualifications in his/her field of expertise whenever that is relevant, but in this case it is not. Pinker's professorship has no connection with the thesis he propounds in The Better Angels of our Nature. It may well be right, but Pinker's areas of expertise are in the fields of experimental psychology, cognitive science and linguistics. He is a Professor of Psychology at Harvard, not history.

[mistermack]

Where neolithic times actually beset by violence? Maybe it was a golden age of peace and love and the mass grave of mutilated corpse mentioned was an abnormal rarity? Isn't drawing a general conclusion from a tiny sample something archaeologists just publish on out of habit? Will the invention of the time machine finally put these questions to rest?

They were violent, from what I can make out. Most older written records talk of extreme violence and wars in a glamorous light.
But the further back you go, the less organised were the logistics. So times were violent, but it was on a more local scale.
Travel was a rare and dangerous thing to do. So whereas we live more peaceful lives day-to-day, we pay for it if we get caught up in a modern war with modern weapons, with enemies coming thousands of miles to kill us.

[Animavore]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... ce+News%29

The reference above is to the degree of neolithic violence that appears to have happened. However, as I read the reference, I thought about the Old Testament violence. On a number of occasions Yahweh directed the children of Isreal to massacre other peoples, but keep their young women for themselves. Of course, the children of Isreral of those times were neolithic, and no doubt very violent. The use of a fictional deity to provide a justification to do horrible things continues to this day.

I was reading The Bible Unearthed in which he says that a lot of the Biblical massacres seem to have no basis in reality from an archaeological perspective. For instance it is said that the Israelites wiped out the Canaanites, but archaeology suggests that the Canaanites simply became Isrealites over time. One theory suggests that Isrealites simpy saw signs of old Canaan culture around them in the ruins and made stories up to describe what happened to them. Evidence that stories like this are made up come in the form of anachronisms, for instance they might mention towns or temples which existed at the time the stories were written but not at the time the story was supposed to take place.

If this is true it makes William Lane Craig's shocking defense of the slaughter (down to asking people to consider the fee-fees of the Jews who had to carry out God's orders) shift from risible to humorous. A lot of moral twisting to come up with justification for a genocide which never even happened

It's been a while since I've read The Bible Unearthed and this is why I've been vague and generalised about what it says, but it's well worth a read.

[cronus]