The Trump Pandemic

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Scot Dutchy
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Scot Dutchy » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:37 am

Well you trust the figures so you must know?
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Tero » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:26 pm

Daily cases in county now 400.
https://www.klkntv.com/lancaster-county ... ase-count/

There is an explanation to this in that there are some 500 unsymptomatic people going around passing it. For college students, at least to your room mate. With that many active cases, it will stay at 400 for weeks.

The college students will give it to their parents at Christmas when they are off. As an exception, all dorms are heated and functioning all of vacation. Normally some are shut down, foreign students more in some dorms.

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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:45 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:37 am
Well you trust the figures so you must know?
That's so weak. Have you learned nothing about supporting a claim or the burden of proof from our 'debates' with religious lunatics in the old days?
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by JimC » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:12 pm

I have read articles (pre-pandemic) suggesting that America's shambolic health system meant that tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths were caused per year, mainly from poor and black communities...
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Scot Dutchy » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:01 pm

JimC wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:12 pm
I have read articles (pre-pandemic) suggesting that America's shambolic health system meant that tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths were caused per year, mainly from poor and black communities...
Well that is the whole point Jim. The USA is a shit country and most of it is third world. All the basics it fails.
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:22 pm

JimC wrote:I have read articles (pre-pandemic) suggesting that America's shambolic health system meant that tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths were caused per year, mainly from poor and black communities...
Indeed. But let's not forget the presumption that it isn't Covid that has killed a quarter of a million people (and rising) in the US but the failures of their health system.

According to WorldoMeters around 60 million people have been infected globally, with around 1.4 million deaths. This is surely a sign of failures in healthcare provision on a global scale(?)

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by JimC » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:47 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:22 pm
JimC wrote:I have read articles (pre-pandemic) suggesting that America's shambolic health system meant that tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths were caused per year, mainly from poor and black communities...
Indeed. But let's not forget the presumption that it isn't Covid that has killed a quarter of a million people (and rising) in the US but the failures of their health system.

According to WorldMeters around 60 million people have been infected globally, with around 1.4 million deaths. This is surely a sign of failures in healthcare provision on a global scale(?)
Yeah, I know that Scot's basic position is to pass the impact of covid off as small beer in comparison to other health issues. However, it is also clear that how well a country's health system worked pre-pandemic will have a significant impact on how successfully that country will be in ameliorating the effects of the pandemic on its own population. So the two issues intertwine.
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Tero » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:50 pm

We've now hit 900 dead, in a state with 1.9 million people.

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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Tero » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:54 pm

"Let's get this over with! I'm too old to get autism from vaccines, anyway."

CNN)Poll of the week: A new Gallup poll finds that 58% of Americans said they would get vaccinated against the coronavirus if there was an FDA-approved vaccine available right now at no cost.

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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Hermit » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:23 pm

Tero wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:50 pm
We've now hit 900 dead, in a state with 1.9 million people.
907 dead, in Australia with 25.6 million people. That's 35 versus 468 deaths/million. On one hand the comparison is not particularly fair. One big, differentiating factor is population density - Nebraska 9.63/km2, Australia 3.3/km2. On the other we don't have your (pl.) absurd individualism. Our state governments invoke emergency acts, allowing them to impose all sorts of restrictions and compunctions, to which relatively few of us object because we are more community-minded. That is a factor, without which our fatality rate would be a lot higher.
So you talk about mobs and the working classes as if they were the question. You've got that eternal idiotic idea that if anarchy came it would come from the poor. Why should it? The poor have been rebels, but they have never been anarchists; they have more interest than anyone else in there being some decent government. The poor man really has a stake in the country. The rich man hasn't; he can go away to New Guinea in a yacht. The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all. Aristocrats were always anarchists. - G.K. Chesterton

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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:01 am

Tero wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:54 pm
"Let's get this over with! I'm too old to get autism from vaccines, anyway."

CNN)Poll of the week: A new Gallup poll finds that 58% of Americans said they would get vaccinated against the coronavirus if there was an FDA-approved vaccine available right now at no cost.
I read a minimum of 70% is required for it to be effective? We are at 65% just now. Too many are suspicious of the speed of development.
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:10 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:01 am
Tero wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:54 pm
"Let's get this over with! I'm too old to get autism from vaccines, anyway."

CNN)Poll of the week: A new Gallup poll finds that 58% of Americans said they would get vaccinated against the coronavirus if there was an FDA-approved vaccine available right now at no cost.
I read a minimum of 70% is required for it to be effective? We are at 65% just now. Too many are suspicious of the speed of development.
We need to achieve about 40% herd immunity to reduce R0 to below 1 and around 60% to bring the prevalence of virus down to levels similar to the seasonal flu. Around 70% should functionally remove it from the population - in time. Compare that to something like the measles, where we need c.95% herd immunity to functionally remove it from the population.
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There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:14 am

According to official figures our R0 is below 1 but of course with no compulsory mask wearing that cant be true.
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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by NineBerry » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:15 am

The one information that isn't there yet is whether the vaccine only prevents symptoms or can also significantly prevent spread. The needed vaccination rate to keep the virus under control is based on how good the vaccine is to prevent spread. This information isn't there yet. They can only get that information at the end of phase 3.

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Re: The Trump Pandemic

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:18 am

NineBerry wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:15 am
The one information that isn't there yet is whether the vaccine only prevents symptoms or can also significantly prevent spread. The needed vaccination rate to keep the virus under control is based on how good the vaccine is to prevent spread. This information isn't there yet. They can only get that information at the end of phase 3.
What is phase 1 and 2? Just asking.
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