Spygate is unravelling

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laklak
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by laklak » Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:01 pm

Hang them. Hang them ALL.

Srsly. We need to start over here.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by L'Emmerdeur » Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:41 pm

Tero wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:17 pm
Yeah but what about Cohen? All he did was arrange Stormy's fee and the Playboy model's abortion.
I see what you did there. :biggrin:

The convict Cohen (convicted of crimes carried out at the instruction of Trump) may have an influence, but that whole caper has faded from the consciousness of the public.

No FBI agent twisted the convict Flynn's arm to make him lie to them. He did that of his own free will. Advised by counsel he then of his own free will pleaded guilty to the charges. I don't see any genuine basis for the pants-wetting over this.

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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:14 pm

L'Emmerdeur wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:41 pm
No FBI agent twisted the convict Flynn's arm to make him lie to them. He did that of his own free will. Advised by counsel he then of his own free will pleaded guilty to the charges. I don't see any genuine basis for the pants-wetting over this.
I do hope you see more by the conclusion of this.

Did you see the recently released documents? Or are you just being 'team-anti-Trump'?
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by L'Emmerdeur » Fri May 01, 2020 3:47 pm

Cunt wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:14 pm
L'Emmerdeur wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:41 pm
No FBI agent twisted the convict Flynn's arm to make him lie to them. He did that of his own free will. Advised by counsel he then of his own free will pleaded guilty to the charges. I don't see any genuine basis for the pants-wetting over this.
I do hope you see more by the conclusion of this.

Did you see the recently released documents? Or are you just being 'team-anti-Trump'?
Yes I read the bullshit evidence Flynn's new defence team filed. It doesn't exonerate Flynn, not even close. He lied to the investigators, which is a crime. He admitted to his crime and pleaded guilty. The documents released by the defence team do not show that Flynn wasn't lying. What they show is that the FBI thought that he was inclined to lie, and with that in mind they discussed how to approach their interactions with him. What do you think the right-wing sources you put so much trust in tell you the documents show?

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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Fri May 01, 2020 3:54 pm

L'Emmerdeur wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 3:47 pm
What do you think the right-wing sources you put so much trust in tell you the documents show?
That they wanted to get him fired, and made a note of it.

Not a huge deal, maybe.

But enough that it could end with him being Press Secretary, fielding questions from the same media who mis-read this story from the start.
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Fri May 01, 2020 3:56 pm

L'Emmerdeur wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 3:47 pm
Yes I read the bullshit evidence Flynn's new defence team filed. It doesn't exonerate Flynn, not even close. He lied to the investigators, which is a crime. He admitted to his crime and pleaded guilty. The documents released by the defence team do not show that Flynn wasn't lying. What they show is that the FBI thought that he was inclined to lie, and with that in mind they discussed how to approach their interactions with him. What do you think the right-wing sources you put so much trust in tell you the documents show?
I've accepted for a long time, that investigators can and do bully people into pleading guilty to avoid what is lovingly called the 'jury tax'.

Accepted the fact of it, not the morality of it. Where do you stand on that?
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by L'Emmerdeur » Fri May 01, 2020 9:01 pm

Cunt wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 3:56 pm
I've accepted for a long time, that investigators can and do bully people into pleading guilty to avoid what is lovingly called the 'jury tax'.

Accepted the fact of it, not the morality of it. Where do you stand on that?
I'm no fan of many police tactics. You have not provided anything to support the claim that Flynn was bullied. Apparently you don't deny that he's guilty of lying to the FBI. Should Flynn be exempt from dealing with law enforcement, including the tactics they use on any other citizen?

The fact is, Flynn didn't lie just once to the FBI. He lied twice about his contacts with Russia, and 'misrepresented' his work for Turkey in official documents. He admitted twice in open court that he'd lied to the FBI, before he pleaded guilty. During sentencing, he told the judge that he had not been coerced to plead guilty or been promised a specific sentence. Trumpists have somehow managed to forget that Trump himself agreed that Flynn had lied to the FBI.

In the documents, there is no statement that the FBI is trying to get Flynn fired. There is a query regarding whether that is the goal of the investigation.

Nor is there any indication that they are were coercing Flynn. They provided an opportunity for him to either lie or tell the truth, and he chose of his own free will to lie.

The judge in the case is a Republican. He found the evidence in the prosecution's case compelling beyond a reasonable doubt, and said in open court that Flynn had basically sold out his country. Flynn's lawyers are desperately trying to finagle this but I don't think they'll succeed, despite Trumpists getting all excited about it.
A new set of defense attorneys retained by Flynn last year has been aggressively challenging the case against him — an uphill task given that Flynn publicly admitted his guilt under oath at a court hearing in December 2017 and reconfirmed those statements a year later at another court session.

[source]
U.S. President Donald Trump said on Saturday that actions by former national security adviser Michael Flynn during the presidential transition were lawful, and that he had had to fire him because Flynn had lied to the FBI and the vice president.

[source]

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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Fri May 01, 2020 9:12 pm

You and CNN might be right about it.

But then I'd have to start believing in more and more conspiracy theories, until finally I had to swallow the 'Russian Collusion' thing whole.

What ever happened to that, anyway? Oh right, smoke and mirrors. No collusion.

If Flynn is exonerated (as opposed to pardoned) I guess you'll have to change your mind.

Meanwhile, I still think he was being a good little General, and the FBI had to fry him for their omlette.
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by pErvinalia » Fri May 01, 2020 11:07 pm

Has it unravelled yet? :yawn:
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Sean Hayden » Fri May 01, 2020 11:32 pm

I don't know why I'm asked to have an opinion on these matters. Isn't being able to lie to the FBI a job requirement for people with that kind of clearance? What the hell am I supposed to know about it? He lied about discussions he had with Russians? I like cucumbers pickled! :freak:
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Sat May 02, 2020 6:39 am

The FBI wasn't supposed to lie to the liar in a certain kind of way, so while they thought their lying spronged him into a lie-trap, it was ineffective, and now they may feel consequences for their (now un-sanctioned) lies.

What's not to understand?
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Sean Hayden » Sat May 02, 2020 7:03 am

:lol:
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by laklak » Sat May 02, 2020 4:57 pm

I, too, enjoy pickled cucumbers. I also like pickled beets, pickled turnips, pickled garlic, pickled cabbage, pickled peppers, pickled cauliflower, pickled eggplant, pickled carrots, dilly beans, pickled herring, pickled pig's feet, pickled souse, pickled (corned) beef, pickled olives, pickled mushrooms. I mean, damn, I just love fucking pickles.
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Joe » Sat May 02, 2020 5:01 pm

Me too. Hell, I even pickle myself from time to time. :drunk:
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Re: Spygate is unravelling

Post by Cunt » Sat May 02, 2020 5:04 pm

Is salt herring the same as pickled?

Is this spygate connected to the flood of crotch-exposing yoga-influencers on instagram? Stretchylicious is getting ridiculous...
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