Jamal Khashoggi

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Svartalf » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:04 pm

you'll vote, and you'll vote right, because the last thing you want is for thet clown to remain in full power.
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Sean Hayden » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:13 pm

But I don't think this is a Trump problem. This is a US problem. We're bad guys.

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Sean Hayden » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:19 pm


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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by L'Emmerdeur » Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:17 pm

An examination of recent history as it relates to the murder of Khashoggi, countering the right wing/Trumpist talking points about how Khashoggi was a nasty, nasty Muslim Brotherhood radical who supported ISIS and was working against the reforming prince Mohammed bin Salman, who after all isn't such a bad guy.

"The Real Reasons Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman Wanted Khashoggi 'Dead or Alive'"
There is more to Khashoggi’s murder than the question of press freedom, however. His death holds the key to understanding the political forces that have helped turn the Middle East from a region of hope seven years ago to one of brutal repression and ongoing slaughter today. Which brings us back to the question of the Saudis’ fear and hatred of the Muslim Brotherhood, the regional rivalries of those who support it and those who oppose it, and the game of thrones in the House of Saud itself. Khashoggi was not central to any of those conflicts, but his career implicated him, fatally, in all of them.

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Clinton Huxley » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:04 pm

laklak wrote:
Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:30 am
So, they admit he died, but it's his own fault. He started a fist fight in the embassy.

You know, I bet he just started punching himself in the head. Over and over again. They tried to stop him, honest, but he was like a wild animal. So they brought in a doctor, who had to amputate his everything in an attempt to save him.
He slipped, on his own spilt blood and fell neck first onto a scimitar that someone had just got as a birthday present.

It's a tragic accident that could happen to anyone in a Saudi consulate.
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Jason » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:25 pm

Yes. And then his body tumbled backward on an inexplicably reciprocating bone saw and was cut into pieces which then fell down a nearby chute and distributed into some sealed bags then accidentally packed into cases and accidentally carried out of the consulate.

All very unfortunate.

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by laklak » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:55 pm

Clinton Huxley wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:04 pm
It's a tragic accident that could happen to anyone in a Saudi consulate.
Insha'Allah.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Clinton Huxley » Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:24 pm

Śiva wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:25 pm
Yes. And then his body tumbled backward on an inexplicably reciprocating bone saw and was cut into pieces which then fell down a nearby chute and distributed into some sealed bags then accidentally packed into cases and accidentally carried out of the consulate.

All very unfortunate.
As Dirk Gently would say, "I hate these smart-arse suicides".
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by JimC » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:22 pm

They've made arrests, apparently...

Basically for not intelligently covering up...
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Svartalf » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:50 pm

hard to cover up intelligently when a guy enters a very public and high profile location alive and inexplicably fails to go out of there for over 2 weeks...
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Hermit » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:30 pm

L'Emmerdeur wrote:
Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:17 pm
An examination of recent history as it relates to the murder of Khashoggi, countering the right wing/Trumpist talking points about how Khashoggi was a nasty, nasty Muslim Brotherhood radical who supported ISIS and was working against the reforming prince Mohammed bin Salman, who after all isn't such a bad guy.

"The Real Reasons Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman Wanted Khashoggi 'Dead or Alive'"
There is more to Khashoggi’s murder than the question of press freedom, however. His death holds the key to understanding the political forces that have helped turn the Middle East from a region of hope seven years ago to one of brutal repression and ongoing slaughter today. Which brings us back to the question of the Saudis’ fear and hatred of the Muslim Brotherhood, the regional rivalries of those who support it and those who oppose it, and the game of thrones in the House of Saud itself. Khashoggi was not central to any of those conflicts, but his career implicated him, fatally, in all of them.
Thanks for the link to that article, L'Emmerdeur. Quite enlightening.

So the dictator of Saudi Arabia arranges for the death of a mouthpiece of the Muslim Brotherhood. I am at a loss in regard to whose side to take. To repurpose a quote by an unnamed Saudi in that article: "Between the onion and the skin there is only the stink." Apologies to all onions, though.
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by pErvinalia » Mon Oct 22, 2018 11:38 pm

I can't believe the rhetoric coming out of the West about this. Apparently this is a line that the Saudis shouldn't have crossed. Slaughtering innocents in Yemen is all ok, though. Selling weapons to a brutal theocracy is all good, as long as they are only killing thousands of kids. Kill one journalist and all of a sudden we have a problem.
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Sean Hayden » Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:20 am

There's some truth to that. I think most people consider war a necessary evil, and one that both sides want to stop as soon as possible. But they accept all the violence that goes with it until it stops. Just think how crazy our rules of war are. Using your reasoning, and there's nothing wrong with it I guess, we are hypocritical to the core. Crumple likes to use gassing people as an example of this. It's okay to shoot everyone, bomb them to bits, and torch them alive, but heaven forbid you gas them. But yeah, heaven forbid you do gas them!

That's why this pisses so many people off who otherwise might not have taken an interest. They expect that what everyone wants is peace; that war is a necessary evil. To them, it's as though Kashoggi was a soldier who put down his rifle, raised a white flag, and surrendered to you, and you shot him dead anyway.

You can't be trusted to be at war because it is a necessary evil. It's right to suppose that you may in fact be evil. You don't resort to violence as a final effort to preserve something worth fighting for. If you're at war you may hide all that ugliness. But there's no hiding it here.

Now it's time to talk more about Yemen. :dunno:

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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:22 am

One of the worst countries for the rights of women. In Yemen they have none. A donkey has more.
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Re: Jamal Khashoggi

Post by Animavore » Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:13 pm

Vice President Pence on Tuesday vowed the U.S. would respond to the "brutal murder" of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi, calling it an "assault on a free and independent press."
https://thehill.com/homenews/administra ... oggi-death

Oh the fucking irony.
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