US Election 2020

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Tero
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Tero » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:07 pm

pErvinalia wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:34 pm
Forty Two wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:05 pm
Howard Schultz is pissing people off by demonstrating just how Left the Democrat Party has lurched. https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/p ... o-far-left
Schultz said the nation cannot afford the priorities of far-left Democrats, including full government-paid health insurance and college tuition. “We are sitting right now with a national debt of $21.5 trillion on the balance sheet of our country,” he said. “And if we were a company, if America was a company, at $21.5 trillion of debt, adding $1 trillion a year, we would be facing insolvency.”

In an interview on CBS’ This Morning, Schultz took issue with Senator (and presidential candidate) Kamala Harris’ (D-Calif.) plan to replace private health insurance with “Medicare for All.”

“You just played Senator Harris as saying she wants to abolish the insurance industry. That’s not correct. That’s not American,” Schultz said.

“What’s next?” Schultz asked. “What industry are we going to abolish next? The coffee industry?”
Could easily be paid for by reducing your ridiculous military budget.
Trump pulls outof UN and NATO, could happen!
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Seabass » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:17 pm

So, the Democratic party covers the center, the center-right, and the center-left, while the Republican party covers the far-right, the extreme-right, the batshit-right, and craziest of all, the evangelical right—but 42 thinks the Dems are the extreme ones.

How on earth can someone who has access to internet, books, libraries, TV, etc, be so divorced from reality? If he lived in a remote and desolate locale, totally cut off from civilization, it would be understandable...
The demagogue is one who preaches doctrines he knows to be untrue to men he knows to be idiots. ―H.L. Mencken

Bad government is the natural product of rule by those who believe government is bad. —Thomas Frank

Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. —Einstein
I’m a nationalist. —Trump

The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country. —Hermann Göring

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Hermit » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:40 pm

Cunt wrote:
Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:48 pm
And I do dismiss most of what you write here, because it is anti-Trump. I already know you are anti-Trump. I don't need to read another article you copy which explains that you are STILL anti-Trump.
In other words: "Do as I say, not as I do."

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Hermit » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:57 pm

Seabass wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:17 pm
How on earth can someone who has access to internet, books, libraries, TV, etc, be so divorced from reality?
Years of explaining how black is really white, and vice versa. Practice makes perfect. Coito Two has done that so often for so long that he really believes his alternative version exists in actual reality. For instance, even though he objected to an Indiana-born judge, Gonzalo P. Curiel, on the grounds of his Mexican heritage, Trump is apparently as non-racist as they come. You see, Trump never ever lynched a negro in his life. Curiel, on the other hand, is a member of an anti-US organisation. QED! What more proof do you need that black really is white?

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Tero » Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:48 pm

A problem with US elections is
1 all the disinformation spread thru social media
2 no checks on advertising BS spread, FOX news spread as news
Someone (rich fat cats saving on taxes? Joe sixpack? ) is spending a lot of money on Trump
https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/01/politics ... index.html
if Trump survives to run (or limp, wounded slightly) in 2020, this will be the most colorful election ever
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Forty Two » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:29 pm

pErvinalia wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:37 pm
Forty Two wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:05 pm
But Schultz is absolutely right about his fellow Democrats. As we have pointed out many times in this space, the Democratic Party has veered to the
extreme left in recent years. So far, in fact, that it is now embracing an economic agenda that is to the left of any other industrialized nation — including China.

Top Democrats have, for example, bear-hugged Bernie Sanders' radical "Medicare for all" plan, which promises "free" government-provided health care benefits more generous than any other nation, and that would cost trillions of dollars a year.
How is it more generous than any other nation?
No cost sharing, etc. https://www.axios.com/medicare-for-all- ... ab897.html
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Hermit » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:45 am

Michael Moore predicts that if the Democrats field a politician Trump will be re-elected. What the Democrats need to do in order to win, says Moore, is to field a "well loved American".

It is well known that in the past several decades political campaigns have increasingly focused on emotion to win votes, but has anyone heard a more profoundly depressing condemnation of the US's psyche? FFS, Michael Moore better be wrong. I suspect he hopes so too.

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Cunt » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:51 am

There are plenty of politicians around. Like bookkeepers or lawyers, their expertise, such as it is, can be brought in where needed.

Why NOT have a regular person in the White House? Are politicians so much better than a 'well loved American'?
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placed himself within a swinging arm's distance from said antifas

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by pErvinalia » Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:01 am

Hermit wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:45 am
Michael Moore predicts that if the Democrats field a politician Trump will be re-elected. What the Democrats need to do in order to win, says Moore, is to field a "well loved American".

It is well known that in the past several decades political campaigns have increasingly focused on emotion to win votes, but has anyone heard a more profoundly depressing condemnation of the US's psyche? FFS, Michael Moore better be wrong. I suspect he hopes so too.
I think a politician is fine when they are a conviction politician like a Bernie Sanders or similar. The problem is crony capitalism where the political class's raison d'etre is to serve corporations, and sees them having to lie through their teeth to the ordinary person as if they have even the slightest interest in them. So basically the neoliberal centre of politics. They are all gross liars and care only about how to enrich themselves and their corporate mates. It's why people are so turned off by politicians now.
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Cunt » Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:14 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:01 am
Hermit wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:45 am
Michael Moore predicts that if the Democrats field a politician Trump will be re-elected. What the Democrats need to do in order to win, says Moore, is to field a "well loved American".

It is well known that in the past several decades political campaigns have increasingly focused on emotion to win votes, but has anyone heard a more profoundly depressing condemnation of the US's psyche? FFS, Michael Moore better be wrong. I suspect he hopes so too.
I think a politician is fine when they are a conviction politician like a Bernie Sanders or similar. The problem is crony capitalism where the political class's raison d'etre is to serve corporations, and sees them having to lie through their teeth to the ordinary person as if they have even the slightest interest in them. So basically the neoliberal centre of politics. They are all gross liars and care only about how to enrich themselves and their corporate mates. It's why people are so turned off by politicians now.
What you wrote right there, coupled with so many people being unwilling to soil themselves by getting into politics, makes for a great system.

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Hermit aka Seraph wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:25 pm
placed himself within a swinging arm's distance from said antifas

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by pErvinalia » Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:51 am

Our political systems are inherently corrupting. To get to the point of electability requires large amounts of donations, and those donations come with implicit strings attached. I suspect a lot of politicians began all idealistic and pure, but soon come to realise that to succeed you have to play by the rules inherent in the system. It's why I think an ideological and people focussed party like the Greens here in Australia, if they found themselves in a position strong enough to form government, would become just as bad as the Labor Party or the Liberal Party.

I'm not sure how that applies to someone like Bernie Sanders, but I suspect he gets the majority of his funding from a large number of small donations as opposed to a small number of huge donations (i.e. from corporations).
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Tero » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:07 am

it's been shown that the main forces acting on gov't are lobbyists. Voters just apply a slight tweak to that. luckily for the fat cats and lobbyists, the large stupid masses are easily led by political ads. This is due to the fact that they do not read much anymore and have short attention spans. MAGA was just that kind of simple concept to grasp while having your Bud Light and watching sports.
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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Hermit » Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:33 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:51 am
Our political systems are inherently corrupting. To get to the point of electability requires large amounts of donations, and those donations come with implicit strings attached. I suspect a lot of politicians began all idealistic and pure, but soon come to realise that to succeed you have to play by the rules inherent in the system. It's why I think an ideological and people focussed party like the Greens here in Australia, if they found themselves in a position strong enough to form government, would become just as bad as the Labor Party or the Liberal Party.
We've had a textbook example of that in 2000 when the Australian Democrats sold out on the GST issue. They sided with the conservative government in agreeing to add a 10% to the price of school textbooks. The ironic part was that in 1980 the Democrat's founder, Don Chipp, famously gave the party its guiding slogan. It was to "keep the bastards honest", the "bastards" being the major parties and/or politicians in general.

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by trdsf » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:18 pm

Cunt wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:51 am
Why NOT have a regular person in the White House? Are politicians so much better than a 'well loved American'?
Have you looked at your average "regular person"? Thanks, no, I want someone if not exceptional, then at least above average. The American presidency is too big and complex a job to settle for less.

I don't expect perfection, but intelligence, experience, and a modicum of humanity will do.
"The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

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Re: US Election 2020

Post by Tero » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:21 pm

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/02/ ... trump.html
The poll even tested prompting respondents with favorable descriptions of Schultz — “Howard Schultz is a true American success story … He believes that the system is broken and there are extremists on both sides, and only an independent centrist can solve the problems that Republicans and Democrats refuse to fix.” — which nonetheless failed to coax more than 9 percent of the public to express support for Schultz’s campaign against any opponent. The polling still found that Schultz’s dismal percentage of support was nonetheless enough to swing the election to Donald Trump against most possible Democratic opponents. So it is simultaneously true that almost nobody likes Schultz and that he could pull enough votes to reelect Trump.
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