Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

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Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Forty Two » Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:39 pm



There has never been a greater engine for the reduction of poverty than the free enterprise system -
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by PsychoSerenity » Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:22 pm

:funny: Tell another one!
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Rum » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:33 pm

He is of course right. Command economies have not succeeded in making their people better off on the whole. Even China's masses didn't start to become prosperous until they let the Capitalism genie out of the bag.

'Self interest' exists in all systems - that is his point - it isn't exclusive to Capitalism. Capitalism may create greater inequality but it undeniably has raised the general prosperity of people living under that system.I wish it wasn't the case given that I'm an old lefty but you can't fly in the face of clear facts. .

Of course that may not always be the case. Why should it be. The internal contradictions within it could well, as Marx predicted, be its downfall. Mass unemployment as capital manages quite well without workers thank you very much could be one such flaw.

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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Feck » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:15 pm

Jesus fucking Christ .

I've not heard anything so fucking horrible for a while .
" ...If you can induce employers by being able to hire "them" with relatively low wages to give "them" on the job training that would make "them"qualify for higher payment and higher productivity "
.
.

Even during a world war the USA was racist . In Mobile Alabama during the second world war all work was stopped murder and mayhem broke out because many black people had shown higher productivity and the employers had decided that "they" would be allowed to become welders ....
How fucking telling is the statement that "they" can qualify by higher productivity for on the job training ?
WTF is that ? Work hard if you want to improve your status from Field nigga to House nigga ????????

If a society can only be profitable because of the undermenchen then it isn't a society. Just as any business that does not pay all it's workers a living wage is not a business .
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by PsychoSerenity » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:35 pm

Rum wrote:He is of course right. Command economies have not succeeded in making their people better off on the whole. Even China's masses didn't start to become prosperous until they let the Capitalism genie out of the bag.

'Self interest' exists in all systems - that is his point - it isn't exclusive to Capitalism. Capitalism may create greater inequality but it undeniably has raised the general prosperity of people living under that system.I wish it wasn't the case given that I'm an old lefty but you can't fly in the face of clear facts. .

Of course that may not always be the case. Why should it be. The internal contradictions within it could well, as Marx predicted, be its downfall. Mass unemployment as capital manages quite well without workers thank you very much could be one such flaw.
Unsupported assertion. False dichotomy. Correlation does not imply causation.

Education and science are the best solutions to poverty, coupled with a cooperative system to fairly distribute the increase in wealth that they create. Right-wing economists want capitalism to take the credit for growth primarily driven by increases in population and advances in technology. Capitalists want to take the credit and all the wealth and promote false narratives of individualism to justify it. Eight billionaires have as much wealth as the world's poorest half. This obscene level of inequality is getting worse at a rate faster than global growth, meaning necessarily that those at the bottom are worse off because of it, even if day-by-day their lives are still improving. More wealth is lost from the poorest countries to the richest through corporate tax evasion than is given the other way as aid, let alone the wealth that is extracted in the form of corporate ownership of natural resources. The idea that privatisation of all education leading to better outcomes as Friedman suggests, is farcical. I didn't watch much further than that through the video. As Feck says, utter bile.
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Animavore » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:27 pm

If you're going to suddenly appear back after a long absence - Do it right!

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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by JimC » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:00 pm

Although it was clearly true that attempts to overthrow capitalism and replace it with state control of the economy doomed themselves by spiralling into vicious totalitarianism, that does not mean that classical capitalism is the best or only way for societies to run. However, whatever alternatives are proposed need to retain the better elements of a free enterprise system, mainly personal freedom and incentives for innovation...
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Brian Peacock » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:31 pm

Freedman made a lot of sense in the context of his times, though his thesis was primarily explanatory rather than structural, but whether his dogma represents an absolute truth which holds in all circumstances and forever is another matter. Market economics certainly generates fiscal resources - when those resources are shared around the livings standards of all are raised, and societies become more stable, peaceful and ordered, better educated, more productive and innovative, healthier, infant mortality falls and population growth levels off as a consequence. Given that capitalism is the dominant economic system I guess the questions is, how many dyed-in-the-wool ideological capitalists are interested in raising the living standards of society as a whole - as opposed to simply securing assets for their exclusive use - and what structural influence can we bring to bear in order to ensure that the system works for all those who have little or no choice about taking part in it?
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Forty Two » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:56 pm

Rum wrote:He is of course right. Command economies have not succeeded in making their people better off on the whole. Even China's masses didn't start to become prosperous until they let the Capitalism genie out of the bag.

'Self interest' exists in all systems - that is his point - it isn't exclusive to Capitalism. Capitalism may create greater inequality but it undeniably has raised the general prosperity of people living under that system.I wish it wasn't the case given that I'm an old lefty but you can't fly in the face of clear facts. .

Of course that may not always be the case. Why should it be. The internal contradictions within it could well, as Marx predicted, be its downfall. Mass unemployment as capital manages quite well without workers thank you very much could be one such flaw.
I'm not sure the evidence bears out the assertion that capitalism creates "greater" inequality. The capitalist countries in the world are generally the ones with lower levels of inequality, including the US. US inequality is high compared to a bunch of small, western European countries. But, compared to the non-capitalist world, the US stacks up very well, as do all of the capitalist western European countries.

When countries go socialist, like in Cuba, like in Venezuela, and even in places like Brazil - inequality is far worse.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Feck » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:12 am

I fact checked And as normal you were wrong 42
http://www.oecd.org/social/inequality.htm
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Feck » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:15 am

:console: You're not having a good thread are you
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by Feck » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:17 am

:fp: If only you could afford a ticket to Mars
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by JimC » Thu Jul 20, 2017 12:41 am

Forty Two wrote:

The capitalist countries in the world are generally the ones with lower levels of inequality, including the US. US inequality is high compared to a bunch of small, western European countries.
The reason for "capitalist countries in the world are generally the ones with lower levels of inequality" is more to do with the higher degree of technology and organised government in western democracies rather than capitalist vs non-capitalist. You can make a good argument that the US is a "hyper-capitalist" society, at least in comparison to the social democracies of western Europe, with government programs are designed to mitigate the effects of capitalism, particular its tendency to create and maintain very large income gaps when under-regulated; that is the reason behind your admission in the second of your sentences...
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:39 am

Oh Jesus. Did he do this on purpose - did he know this could set me off? I'm too busy today to devote a rant to this. Maybe in the coming days. Although, the current AD that I'm on isn't conducive to ranting. Sigh. This topic could deserve a rant.
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Re: Capitalism, The Best Solution to Poverty

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:44 am

Rum wrote:Capitalism may create greater inequality but it undeniably has raised the general prosperity of people living under that system.I wish it wasn't the case given that I'm an old lefty but you can't fly in the face of clear facts. .
My fucking God, my rant gland is twitching like a mother fucker now. Seriously, how many fucking times does this bullshit need to be debunked?
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