London: Another van attack nr Finsbury Park Mosque

[cronus]

Abusing 'mental health' as a get out of jail or societal issues free card is both stigmatising and absurd. Hundreds and thousands of certified mentally ill people hold driving licences. There's a simple wrong answer to every problem - leave them in the 20th C. where they belong. A father of four, worked as a barman, both require some social skills. Member of a extreme right group and they avoid outright loonies or give them a kicking.

[pErvinalia]

It's entirely possible to be both a terrorist and mentally ill.

[JimC]

It's entirely possible to be both a terrorist and mentally ill.

However, it is also possible to be a fundamentalist islamic terrorist whose mind virus has created a situation where it seems utterly rational that killing the infidel anywhere and anytime is the correct and logical course of action...

[pErvinalia]

Yeah, but this idea that suggesting someone is mentally ill is "abusing 'mental health'", is silly.

The "terrorist/terrorism" label is an interesting issue. Apparently the locals were upset that it wasn't labelled terrorism immediately. But expecting every fucking event to be labelled as terrorism would seem to water down the concept. Terrorism is usually backed by some ideology for social/government change by violent and/or extreme means. Islamic terrorism certainly fits that description. But a "lone wolf" (I'm not declaring that this guy is that) who commits a terrible hate crime isn't necessarily a terrorist. I'd say, though, that many of these right wing anti islam and nationalist groups are borderline terrorist groups, particularly if they are inciting people to commit the kinds of acts this bloke did. And if he was a member of one of these groups and part of his ideology is to exclude Muslims from society via violent means, then he's a terrorist.

[cronus]

Need a body count for it to be terrorism in my book. No body count you've either got murder/manslaughter or a hate crime, or both. This was obviously a hate crime by a guy of low status holding a grudge against the outsiders. Displacement/transferal activity after a marriage split up. Normal ape behaviour. Seen it on the monkey channel before.

[Scot Dutchy]

This is all being handled in a very PC fashion in fact overtly.

[cronus]

This is all being handled in a very PC fashion in fact overtly.

When is a planet not a planet...

[rainbow]

This is all being handled in a very PC fashion in fact overtly.

Bah.
Internment camps for the Welsh, I say!

[cronus]

This is all being handled in a very PC fashion in fact overtly.

Bah.
Internment camps for the Welsh, I say!

Rebuild Offa's Dyke and let the God's sort them out.

[pErvinalia]

This is all being handled in a very PC fashion in fact overtly.

Yeah, this is something I noticed too. Apparently the conservative governments where I've seen this happening (UK and Australia) fail to see the irony of them doing that. The very same governments and right wing ideology that has been going on and on for nearly a couple of decades ramping up the fear of 'others' and peddling divisive and white nationalistic rhetoric. Well this is what you get, dickheads. I'd actually respect them more if they just acted as normal and acted like the Muzzies deserved it.

[Scot Dutchy]

Over the top is a phrase that comes to mind.

[Hermit]

Terrorism is usually backed by some ideology for social/government change by violent and/or extreme means.

Yes. And Darren Osborne has one. It's called islamophobia. So, yes, he may have been acting as a lone wolf, but he perpetrated what can only be literally described as a terrorist act based on that ideology, an ideology fostered by any number of right wing lunatic organisations such as the EDL, UKIP and so forth. Although he is not known to be a member of any of them, there is no record of him being mentally ill either.

[pErvinalia]

Islamophobia isn't an ideology. It's a trait. White nationalism or some form of apartheid is an ideology.

[Alan B]

To what extent does the demise of the NHS (and treating mental health care as a sideline) contribute to the actions of these 'loners'?

The general impression could be "What's the use. I can't get help. Fuck 'em all." In effect blaming others for their unsolved problems.

Quite different, I suspect, from the terrorist acting upon a religious ideal.

[cronus]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-40347813

Can't even use that Welsh black humour on Facebook....not that much of a loner simply a typical dour Welshman, then?