We need to talk about Donald – the Nightmare continues

[Tero]

Farmers hurt by Trump budget. No more 2 scoops of ice cream for Trump:

The programs were deemed “duplicative and underperforming” in the president’s skinny budget. Neither USDA nor Office of Management and Budget officials responded to a request for further explanation of the proposal.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_59274 ... mg00000009

Give Trump some tofu from now on.

[Animavore]

On Paris, it’s Trump and the fossil fuel industry versus everyone else on earth

In the past few years, reactionary politicians across the world have been seizing power with the backing of fossil fuel interests. One of those politicians, Donald Trump, is contemplating attacking international climate action by taking the United States out of the Paris Climate Agreement.

Since the Paris agreement was signed, the threats of climate change have become even more clear. 2016 was the hottest year in recorded history (followed by runners-up 2015 and 2014), the polar ice sheets have both seen dire events this year, and superstorms have ravaged communities across the planet.

Backing away from climate action now is immoral, economically counter-productive, and politically foolish.
Here are all the signs that show climate justice is a goal we can achieve — if world leaders stay in Paris and commit to more serious action, and we stay in the streets demanding it.

Global carbon emissions have stopped growing — now we need to make them decline.

Coal is in free fall.

Electric cars keep switching on, and combustion engines keep turning off.

More money is moving out of the fossil fuel industry.

China’s emissions are decreasing as investment in solar increases.

Scientists are angry, and they are getting organized.

Solar and wind energy now employ more people in the US than coal and gas — and almost 10 million people worldwide.

The world’s most climate vulnerable countries are leading the way to 100% renewable energy.

Click on link to read the points in full. https://medium.com/@350/on-paris-its-tr ... f9caf9eebe


So as you can see scientifically, economically, and morally, switching to cleaner energy is the way to go. And with some developing countries paving the way Trump and the US are without excuse in not following, or even leading. But if they want China to lead and become the World's leading energy superpower...

[mistermack]

There's something missing in the renewable energy story, and it doesn't want to go away.
And that's continuity of supply.

Let me know when it's been solved, and I will take you seriously. But right now, every method of solving it involves the price going up dramatically.

If people compared the price of CONTINUOUS supply for renewable energy and fossil fuel, it would be a fair comparison. But they never do.

When you don't face facts head on, you don't deserve credibility.

[JimC]

There's something missing in the renewable energy story, and it doesn't want to go away.
And that's continuity of supply.

Let me know when it's been solved, and I will take you seriously. But right now, every method of solving it involves the price going up dramatically.

If people compared the price of CONTINUOUS supply for renewable energy and fossil fuel, it would be a fair comparison. But they never do.

When you don't face facts head on, you don't deserve credibility.

Over the network of a whole country, or group of countries, with a mix of solar, wind and hydro, for example it evens out to a degree, with wind in one place, calm in another, sunny somewhere else and not so sunny there...

Add a certain degree of battery or other storage to the mix, plus rapid gas generators for emergencies, then you have a largely renewable, robust system..

[Hermit]

There's something missing in the renewable energy story, and it doesn't want to go away.
And that's continuity of supply.

Continuity of supply will come as storage technology evolves. Meanwhile, electricity generated by rooftop solar systems alone is already beneficial. In NSW, where solar energy is in its infancy, the lack of it would have necessitated an additional fossil fuel powered electricity generator. Given that 70% of the state's electricity comes from coal, that's represents a reduction of many thousands of tons in CO2 emission. During a three-day heatwave last summer, rooftop PV installations also prevented brownouts and reduced the power bill by AU$800 million. The beauty of solar is that it works best when it is needed the most - during peak periods of air conditioning use.

Your argument reminds me of that used by the gun lobby, which states that gun restrictions are useless because they will never totally eradicate murder. Both are idiotic.

[pErvinalia]

There's something missing in the renewable energy story, and it doesn't want to go away.
And that's continuity of supply.

Let me know when it's been solved, and I will take you seriously. But right now, every method of solving it involves the price going up dramatically.

If people compared the price of CONTINUOUS supply for renewable energy and fossil fuel, it would be a fair comparison. But they never do.

When you don't face facts head on, you don't deserve credibility.

What's missing is the subsidisation of the fossil fuel sector. When you price that (and externalities like general pollution and global warming) in, renewables are way cheaper even with more expensive storage options.

[JimC]

There's something missing in the renewable energy story, and it doesn't want to go away.
And that's continuity of supply.

Continuity of supply will come as storage technology evolves. Meanwhile, electricity generated by rooftop solar systems alone is already beneficial. In NSW, where solar energy is in its infancy, the lack of it would have necessitated an additional fossil fuel powered electricity generator. Given that 70% of the state's electricity comes from coal, that's represents a reduction of many thousands of tons in CO2 emission. During a three-day heatwave last summer, rooftop PV installations also prevented brownouts and reduced the power bill by AU$800 million. The beauty of solar is that it works best when it is needed the most - during peak periods of air conditioning use.

Certainly true for us - basically, on the relatively few days we use our aircon, the solar panels are working at their maximum, and covering most if not all of our aircon load...

[Animavore]

One thing missing from the denialist story is a refusal to look toward the future and new tech. They're like people wh o moaned about people using clocks instead of good, old fashion sundial.

Whatever. Leave them behind with all the other Alf Garnett's of the World.

[mistermack]

So in certain wealthy hot countries, where the sun is reliable and people use (and can afford) a lot of air conditioning, solar can help to provide peak power.
Very good.

If people stuck to that argument, I would take them seriously.

Just don't keep pretending that it's on a par with fossil fuel, till it IS !!

Fossil fuel doesn't need solar, but solar needs fossil fuel. FACT.

People claim a price for renewables, but renewables could never offer that price, if it wasn't for fossil fuel coming to it's aid.

Add the price of building and maintaining the fossil fuel system, and it's fuel, to the price of renewables, and you might then quote an honest price for solar and wind.

Water of course stands alone as a real and genuine renewable energy supply.
Shame there's not more of it.
Can't they use wind and solar to pump water up a hill to a reservoir?
The end price for that energy WOULD be an honest price to compare with fossil.

[pErvinalia]

That's exactly what they are doing. Go back to sleep grandpa.

[Hermit]

So in certain wealthy hot countries, where the sun is reliable and people use (and can afford) a lot of air conditioning, solar can help to provide peak power.
Very good.

If people stuck to that argument, I would take them seriously.

Just don't keep pretending that it's on a par with fossil fuel, till it IS !!

You'd make an excellent opponent to the development of the horseless carriage. When Benz introduced it, it was less powerful than a horse, slower, less reliable and more expensive to run. The same argument can be made against the Wright Brothers' first demonstration of their heavier than air flight contraption. The time scale is different. The underlying principle is not.

[mistermack]

So in certain wealthy hot countries, where the sun is reliable and people use (and can afford) a lot of air conditioning, solar can help to provide peak power.
Very good.

If people stuck to that argument, I would take them seriously.

Just don't keep pretending that it's on a par with fossil fuel, till it IS !!

You'd make an excellent opponent to the development of the horseless carriage. When Benz introduced it, it was less powerful than a horse, slower, less reliable and more expensive to run. The same argument can be made against the Wright Brothers' first demonstration of their heavier than air flight contraption. The time scale is different. The underlying principle is not.

So you're argument is that renewables are shit at the moment, but you are hoping it will get better?

Well, you can make things better without wasting a fortune on using it to excess while it's worse.
Would it have been advisable for everybody to ditch their cars or horses, and use Wright Brothers planes? Naaaaaaaaaaah.

[Animavore]

Your time here is obviously coming to a close. Time to take the short holiday to Switzerland, methinks. Leave the inheritance to the young before you squander it on them.

[mistermack]

Your time here is obviously coming to a close. Time to take the short holiday to Switzerland, methinks. Leave the inheritance to the young before you squander it on them.

Pissed again I see.
Bit early, even for you !

[Animavore]

No. I'm stone, cold sober.