Iranian SU-25's fire on US drone in international airspace

[Coito ergo sum]

The drone was not hit.

The Obama administration did not disclose the incident, which occurred just days before the presidential election on November 1, but three senior officials confirmed the details to CNN. http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/0 ... ?hpt=hp_t3

[klr]

The drone was not hit.

The Obama administration did not disclose the incident, which occurred just days before the presidential election on November 1, but three senior officials confirmed the details to CNN. http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/0 ... ?hpt=hp_t3

Su-25s? That's a ground attack aircraft.

Doesn't say much for their shooting if they can't hit a slow and non-manoeuvring target with Gatling guns.

EDIT: They might have missed on purpose, but I can't really see why they'd do that given their previous behaviour.

[Ian]

In other news, a Russian attack submarine has been sighted near Florida.

Or so I've heard.

[Jason]

[Pensioner]

The drone was not hit.

The Obama administration did not disclose the incident, which occurred just days before the presidential election on November 1, but three senior officials confirmed the details to CNN. http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/0 ... ?hpt=hp_t3

And I did not win the Lotto on Saturday either, Why was that not mentioned?

[Jason]

[ronmcd]

The drone was not hit.

The Obama administration did not disclose the incident, which occurred just days before the presidential election on November 1, but three senior officials confirmed the details to CNN. http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/0 ... ?hpt=hp_t3

Theres a ... um ... slightly different take in the Guardian about the accuracy or otherwise of this story :

Barbara Starr, CNN's Pentagon reporter (more accurately known as: the Pentagon's reporter at CNN), has an exciting exclusive today. Exclusively relying upon "three senior officials" in the Obama administration (all anonymous, needless to say), she claims that "two Iranian Su-25 fighter jets fired on an unarmed US Air Force Predator drone in the Persian Gulf last week," while "the drone was in international airspace east of Kuwait . . . engaged in routine maritime surveillance." The drone was not hit, but, says CNN, "the incident raises fresh concerns within the Obama administration about Iranian military aggression in crucial Gulf oil shipping lanes."

First things first: let us pause for a moment to extend our thoughts and prayers to this US drone. Although it was not physically injured, being shot at by the Iranians - while it was doing nothing other than peacefully minding its own business - must have been a very traumatic experience. I think I speak on behalf of everyone, regardless of political views, when I say that we all wish this brave hero a speedy recovery and hope it is back in full health soon, protecting our freedom.

The CNN report on this incident is revealing indeed. Every paragraph - literally - contains nothing but mindless summaries of the claims of US government officials. There is not an iota of skepticism about any of the assertions, including how this incident happened, what the drone was doing at the time, or where it took place. It is pure US government press release - literally; I defy anyone to identify any differences if the US government had issued its own press release directly rather than issuing it masquerading as a leaked CNN report.

Most notably, CNN does not even bother with the pretense of trying to include the claims of the Iranian government about what happened. There is no indication that the self-described news outlet even made an effort to contact Tehran to obtain their rendition of these events or even confirmation that it occurred. It simply regurgitates the accusations of anonymous US officials that Iran, with no provocation, out of the blue decided to shoot at a US drone in international airspace. (Although CNN does not mention it, last December Iran shot down a US drone which, it claims (and the US does not deny) was in Iranian air space).

That CNN's prime mission is to serve the US government is hardly news.

continued ...

[..]

UPDATE

The Washington Post's report describes the incident as having taken place "near Iranian airspace", and then posts a map to illustrate just how close. Like CNN, though, the Post bases all of its "reporting" on what the US government claims, and does not indicate that it even attempted to obtain comment from the Iranians, simply noting instead that "Iranian media had not reported on the Nov. 1 incident as of Thursday afternoon."

Moreover, if it turns out that the claim of the US government is accurate and the drone was just outside of Iran's airspace: does anyone have any thoughts on what the fate would be of an Iranian drone that was found just outside the airspace of the US on the Eastern seaboard, or right near Israeli airspace? I suspect that a lot more than an Iranian drone would be shot at. I'm also quite certain that, in reporting on such an incident, CNN and the Washington Post would be certain to include the views of the US or Israeli governments.

[FBM]

The drone was not hit.

The Obama administration did not disclose the incident, which occurred just days before the presidential election on November 1, but three senior officials confirmed the details to CNN. http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/0 ... ?hpt=hp_t3

Theres a ... um ... slightly different take in the Guardian about the accuracy or otherwise of this story :

Barbara Starr, CNN's Pentagon reporter (more accurately known as: the Pentagon's reporter at CNN), has an exciting exclusive today. Exclusively relying upon "three senior officials" in the Obama administration (all anonymous, needless to say), she claims that "two Iranian Su-25 fighter jets fired on an unarmed US Air Force Predator drone in the Persian Gulf last week," while "the drone was in international airspace east of Kuwait . . . engaged in routine maritime surveillance." The drone was not hit, but, says CNN, "the incident raises fresh concerns within the Obama administration about Iranian military aggression in crucial Gulf oil shipping lanes."

First things first: let us pause for a moment to extend our thoughts and prayers to this US drone. Although it was not physically injured, being shot at by the Iranians - while it was doing nothing other than peacefully minding its own business - must have been a very traumatic experience. I think I speak on behalf of everyone, regardless of political views, when I say that we all wish this brave hero a speedy recovery and hope it is back in full health soon, protecting our freedom.

The CNN report on this incident is revealing indeed. Every paragraph - literally - contains nothing but mindless summaries of the claims of US government officials. There is not an iota of skepticism about any of the assertions, including how this incident happened, what the drone was doing at the time, or where it took place. It is pure US government press release - literally; I defy anyone to identify any differences if the US government had issued its own press release directly rather than issuing it masquerading as a leaked CNN report.

Most notably, CNN does not even bother with the pretense of trying to include the claims of the Iranian government about what happened. There is no indication that the self-described news outlet even made an effort to contact Tehran to obtain their rendition of these events or even confirmation that it occurred. It simply regurgitates the accusations of anonymous US officials that Iran, with no provocation, out of the blue decided to shoot at a US drone in international airspace. (Although CNN does not mention it, last December Iran shot down a US drone which, it claims (and the US does not deny) was in Iranian air space).

That CNN's prime mission is to serve the US government is hardly news.

continued ...

[..]

UPDATE

The Washington Post's report describes the incident as having taken place "near Iranian airspace", and then posts a map to illustrate just how close. Like CNN, though, the Post bases all of its "reporting" on what the US government claims, and does not indicate that it even attempted to obtain comment from the Iranians, simply noting instead that "Iranian media had not reported on the Nov. 1 incident as of Thursday afternoon."

Moreover, if it turns out that the claim of the US government is accurate and the drone was just outside of Iran's airspace: does anyone have any thoughts on what the fate would be of an Iranian drone that was found just outside the airspace of the US on the Eastern seaboard, or right near Israeli airspace? I suspect that a lot more than an Iranian drone would be shot at. I'm also quite certain that, in reporting on such an incident, CNN and the Washington Post would be certain to include the views of the US or Israeli governments.

Fucking I say.

[JimC]

All drones desire to mate with queen bees, but most will die unfulfilled...

[mistermack]

Since US drones have a long history of disregarding national borders, and killing people in countries where they have no permission to fly, it's perfectly fair to shoot them down, if you feel like it.

Nothing wrong with that at all.

[Coito ergo sum]

Well, if you think it's no big deal that Iran fires on US military assets in international airspace, then that is your view of it.

If the story is false, well, obviously, that's another matter. Was the drone in Iranian airspace? The Guardian rails against CNN, claiming that it did not look into the Iranian position on the matter. However, Iran has remained silent on the matter. http://edition.cnn.com/2012/11/09/world ... hter-jets/

It certainly isn't surprising, of course, that CNN's article would not sound particularly hard on the Obama Administration. The Guardian is right on about that -- I mean, the story wasn't released until after the election, even though it happened on 11/1. CNN often soft-pedals stories that can be injurious to the President. Not so much as MSNBC, of course, but often.

The silly little jokes about how the drone wasn't injured and all that are, well, just plain stupid. This kind of incident, if true, is a serious violation of international law.

"Our aircraft was never in Iranian airspace. It was always flying in international airspace. The recognized limit is 12 nautical miles off the coast, and we never entered the 12-nautical mile limit," he said.

CNN has been unable to obtain a response from the Iranian Foreign Ministry.

The drone's still and video cameras captured the incident, showing the two Su-25s approaching and firing their onboard guns, the officials said.
The Iranian pilots continued to fire shots that went beneath the Predator but never hit it, according to the officials.

Iran has not addressed the allegations.

[Coito ergo sum]

Since US drones have a long history of disregarding national borders, and killing people in countries where they have no permission to fly, it's perfectly fair to shoot them down, if you feel like it.

Nothing wrong with that at all.

Ian -- do you want to take this one?

[ronmcd]

The silly little jokes about how the drone wasn't injured and all that are, well, just plain stupid. This kind of incident, if true, is a serious violation of international law.

Well, goodness me, the UN should damn well do something about such wanton violations! I can tell you, I'm seething with righteous indignation! Down with this sort of thing, as Father Ted would say!

We can be thankful that the Americans would never violate international law.

last December Iran shot down a US drone which, it claims (and the US does not deny) was in Iranian air space

Iran Air Flight 655 was a civilian jet airliner shot down by U.S. missiles on 3 July 1988 as it flew over the Strait of Hormuz at the end of the Iran–Iraq War.

Bombing Iran is clearly the only remaining course of action after this shocking violation of international law.

/sarcasm

[Coito ergo sum]

The silly little jokes about how the drone wasn't injured and all that are, well, just plain stupid. This kind of incident, if true, is a serious violation of international law.

Well, goodness me, the UN should damn well do something about such wanton violations! I can tell you, I'm seething with righteous indignation! Down with this sort of thing, as Father Ted would say!

No need to seethe, or be indignant, righteously or otherwise. It is what it is.

We can be thankful that the Americans would never violate international law.

last December Iran shot down a US drone which, it claims (and the US does not deny) was in Iranian air space

Iran Air Flight 655 was a civilian jet airliner shot down by U.S. missiles on 3 July 1988 as it flew over the Strait of Hormuz at the end of the Iran–Iraq War.

Bombing Iran is clearly the only remaining course of action after this shocking violation of international law.

/sarcasm

Only an abject simpleton would seriously think that.

[ronmcd]

The silly little jokes about how the drone wasn't injured and all that are, well, just plain stupid. This kind of incident, if true, is a serious violation of international law.

Well, goodness me, the UN should damn well do something about such wanton violations! I can tell you, I'm seething with righteous indignation! Down with this sort of thing, as Father Ted would say!

No need to seethe, or be indignant, righteously or otherwise. It is what it is.

No seething indignation, just sarcasm at the idea that destroying an unmanned offensive weapon contitutes a serious violation of international law. Especially when it appears the same offensive weapons have previously crossed into Iranian air space. Presumably violating international law.

What do you think would happen if a unmanned offensive weapon flew anywhere near US airspace?

I think the silly little joke in the article made the point very well.