Fast Food Worker Strikes!

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Warren Dew
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Warren Dew » Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:13 pm

piscator wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
piscator wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:Higher cost of grain causes higher cost of producing grain finished beef.
Higher cost of grain finished beef causes higher prices for grain finished beef.
Higher price of grain finished beef causes some consumers to switch to grass fed beef.
Consumers switching to grass fed beef causes increased demand for grass fed beef.
Increased demand for grass fed beef causes increased prices for grass fed beef.
Is this the same guy who previously argued the demand for labor at McDonald's would drop if the minimum wage increased?
Yes.

A minimum wage increase increases the costs at McDonald's, so demand will drop.
You talk like labor is optional for McDonald's, but beef is required for consumers.
Sloppy reading on your part. If you read the next line past what you quoted, you'll see that I think demand for corn fed beef will fall if its price rises, which wouldn't happen if it were "required for consumers".
Grass fed beef is expensive
And yet, some people buy it anyway, because it's more humane, or because it's healthier, or both.
because slaughter cows weigh less, and grass fed beef needs to spend a month aging in cold storage before it's marketable. 6 weeks in a feedlot is cheaper than a month aging on a meathook in a refrigerator, and not solely because the same cow will weigh a couple hundred pounds more when finished on grain.
Cold storage is expensive as fuck, and inefficient because you can't optimize the space in a big refrigerator with hanging beef. So you have a big expensive power-hungry refrigerator that you can only fill 50%.
Then you have supply chain costs. It's not like slaughterhouses have acres and acres of refrigerators to handle a month's production. No. Sides of beef have to be shipped around in half-full trucks of swinging hanging beef sides. Not only is that inefficient trucking, but the inertia of swinging beef is dangerous and expensive to insure because trucks are more likely to roll over. It's no mystery why the world beef industry switched to grain fed 40 or 50 years ago: it's much more profitable.
You're completely confused here. Most grass finished beef is not dry aged, as you describe. Certainly none of the grass finished beef I buy is dry aged, and I buy a lot of grass finished beef. It's true that some grass finished beef is dry aged and thus even more expensive, but it's actually much easier to find corn finished beef that's dry aged.

The beef industry mostly switched to grain finished beef because grain became cheaper than grass, partly because of fossil fuel derived fertilizers, and partly because of agricultural subsidies. It had nothing to do with aging requirements.
So we have Warren and CES thinking that labor is optional for McDonald's business, and Seth who thinks he can skip feeding his cows on hardscrabble Texas Panhandle pasture and still produce a marketable product. Absolutely bygod brilliant, boys.
Actually what we have is Piscator responding without actually reading and understanding what he's responding to.

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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by piscator » Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:05 am

Warren Dew wrote: Actually what we have is Piscator responding without actually reading and understanding what he's responding to.

I understand this shit a lot better than you, Warren.

1. If you put the same $$ in bringing 2 cows to the American consumer, the one that's 200lbs heavier is cheaper/lb to produce. That's the primary economic driver of feedlots. The secondary driver is that $4/day in subsidized grain and antibiotics is cheaper than $6/day in unsubsidized refrigeration plus $2/day in logistics and other associated costs for 2 grass fed beef halves that are worth less because they weigh less and hence, contain less product.

2. You must age grass fed beef to produce a consistent product that's up to the same quality standards of grain fed beef. McDonald's doesn't use grass fed beef primarily for this reason - it's not consistent and uniform enough to work with their business model. The fact that grain fed beef is much cheaper in the US is secondary for McDonald's. They'd pay more for it and pass it on vs changing their flavors and proven successful business formula.

3. McDonald's needs X people to run a store, regardless of labor costs. McDonald's hires people because they have to to make $$. It's not optional.
Moreover, McDonald's can pass on increased minimum wage costs to their customers a few pennies at a time, exactly like all their competitors will.

4. People eat beef because they want to, not because they have to. It's optional. Therefore, higher consumer costs for the same beef product will directly affect demand.
This is a very different situation than McDonald's labor costs. Labor is not optional for McDonald's, and they pass on 100% of their costs. Beef is optional for American consumers, and they can't pass on the cost. They eat it.

5. Just stop with the bullshit and contrived just-so stories. You don't eat un-aged grass fed beef.

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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Warren Dew » Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:00 am

piscator wrote:5. Just stop with the bullshit and contrived just-so stories. You don't eat un-aged grass fed beef.
Good to know you actually eat lots of beef, and are just pretending to eat fish to win an argument.

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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by piscator » Sat Sep 28, 2013 3:47 am

I'm in the food business, Warren. :biggrin:



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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Warren Dew » Sat Sep 28, 2013 6:36 am

I guess that explains why you're pushing fish - and maybe why you seem to feel so threatened by ranchers like Seth.

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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by pErvinalia » Sun Sep 29, 2013 7:04 am

Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by MrJonno » Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:16 am

rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by JimC » Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:40 am

MrJonno wrote:
rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth
Even if you've stopped breathing... :?
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by klr » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:40 am

MrJonno wrote:
rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth thinks you're a Marxist.
:fix:
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Hermit » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:47 am

klr wrote:
MrJonno wrote:
rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth thinks you're a Marxist.
:fix:
:hilarious:

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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by klr » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:49 am

Hermit wrote:
klr wrote:
MrJonno wrote:
rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth thinks you're a Marxist.
:fix:
:hilarious:

Therefore neither Collector Leet nor Gallstones breathe, Warren and Laklak are comatose and Coito is on life support.
Yeah, but adding the disclaimer would have spoiled the joke. I claim artistic licence. :pardon:
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Hermit » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:51 am

No problem. I was just playing the straight guy. ;)
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by klr » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:59 am

All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players

:drama:

How did we get from fast food to The Bard? :ask:
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by Seth » Sun Sep 29, 2013 4:45 pm

klr wrote:
MrJonno wrote:
rEvolutionist wrote:Picscator is a Marxist, like you and I. That's why he fears Seth. :hehe:
If you are breathing its a good reason to fear Seth thinks you're a Marxist.
:fix:
Only if you want me to pay for your oxygen.
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Re: Fast Food Worker Strikes!

Post by MrJonno » Sun Sep 29, 2013 6:40 pm

Well taxes are collected to ensure air quality, so look out everyone
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