Has Obama totally fucking lost the plot?

[laklak]

He can't LOSE the plot, he IS the fucking plot.

[SteveB]

Pretty sure that's Mitch McConnell.

[laklak]

That's what they want you to think...

[JimC]

I have never used an iPhone. I've considered buying one, but I wouldn't use it much. I assume I could figure out how to use it, but who knows.

We have a 17 year old son to figure out stuff like that. We will undoubtedly revert back to the dark ages were he to leave home...

[Coito ergo sum]

I think it's pretty lame that he couldn't figure out an Iphone right away, but I've always been really good with technology.

The iPhone is the only cell phone I've ever been able to figure out right away.

It's the double standard that I was pointing out:

George HW Bush is lambasted for commenting on check-out counter technology, and McCain skewered because he didn't use email. Obama is totally reasonable in being befuddled by an iPhone.

Other double standards:

Palin's husband joined some radical third party in Alaska, and the press was all over it and he was lambasted for it. Obama himself was a member of the expressly socialist "New Party" and it's just fine. No biggie.

W.Bush was skewered for a 25 year old DUI (on the eve of an election), and there was endless hand wringing about whether he ever used cocaine. Obama, an admitted profligate drug user, member of the Choom Gang, coke, pot, etc. -- no probs. Fuck, they chased the Bush daughters around to see if they would get drunk....

Biden and Obama's gaffes are rationalized and/or ignored. Every gaffe by a Republican is put under a magnifying glass.

[Ian]

And you wonder why that double standard about personal behavior exists? Maybe if Republicans didn't spend so much time bitching about family values and moral decline while constantly trying to put their noses in other people's private lives then the media would give them the same treatment.

This is the fundamental difference between liberals and conservatives. Liberals believe business and industry ought to be well-regulated, but they take a laissez-faire approach to culture and controlling what people are allowed to do in their private lives. With conservatives, it's exactly the opposite: let business do whatever it wants, but don't you dare try to get married to someone of the same sex, or deal with your own birth control, or regulate the sub-machine gun I want to carry in my jacket, etc.
Libertarians are a whole other discussion.

Many Republicans DESERVE the double-standard because they bring it on themselves.

[Coito ergo sum]

And you wonder why that double standard about personal behavior exists? Maybe if Republicans didn't spend so much time bitching about family values and moral decline while constantly trying to put their noses in other people's private lives then the media would give them the same treatment.

This is the fundamental difference between liberals and conservatives. Liberals believe business and industry ought to be well-regulated, but they take a laissez-faire approach to culture and controlling what people are allowed to do in their private lives. With conservatives, it's exactly the opposite: let business do whatever it wants, but don't you dare try to get married to someone of the same sex, or deal with your own birth control, or regulate the sub-machine gun I want to carry in my jacket, etc.
Libertarians are a whole other discussion.

Many Republicans DESERVE the double-standard because they bring it on themselves.

LOL -- up until 3 months ago the Democrat Party officially opposed gay marriage too. So much more enlightened....

[Ian]

Weak argument is weak.

Which party is still against it?

[Coito ergo sum]

Weak argument is weak.

Which party is still against it?

The GOP. You win. Be as sanctimonious as you want about it now, because the Democratic Party changed their position three months ago. LOL. It would be like the US claiming superiority over Brazil because we outlawed slavery 20 years before they did. Yay for us! We're so much better!

It's just a smoke screen. In a few years, it'll be legal in all the states. 10 years ago, there were only one or two countries in the world that had legalized gay marriage. 20 years ago it was by definition a psychological disorder according to most psychiatric organizations. 30 years ago it was still a crime on the books in most western nations.

Now, some states allow gay marriage. It's happening, and the conservatives will follow suit soon enough. Older people are really the only major demographic holding out, and that's because when they were kids homosexuality was overwhelmingly considered an abomination and a crime. FFS, the amount of progress made in the last 10 years is exponentially greater than in the previous 50. In another 10 years, only a declining minority of people will still think gay marriage is something that ought to be prohibited.

[Ian]

All completely true. When it comes to the two parties today, I would only fault the Democrats (Obama in particular, anyway) for keeping quiet until they had enough polling data indicating the shift in public opinion, rather than leading the charge on it. But sometimes such a charge can be counter-productive.

It still doesn't change the fact that conservatives are the ones who make themselves hysterical about such things, until the day comes when the opinions of the few left who still feel that way no longer matter. Just like for voting rights, desegregation, acceptance of birth control and divorce, women rising in the work force, and about a million other social issues one might care to bring up.

You're defending the ball and chain for being just a few feet behind the leg that's nevertheless dragging it along. I prefer to be a part of the leg and occasionally gripe about the ball that's holding me back. If you're the one running a race, you don't judge yourself by whether or not you've already reached the finish line or not, you judge yourself by the pace you make as you go. Note: the race we're all in has no finish line.

Absolutely I'll point out the difference between one mindset and the other, even if you don't think they amount to much. I think the difference amounts to a great deal, to a great many people.

Still, I'd say conservatives do hold a valuable place in society: they keep social progress from moving too far too fast. I think there may be some value there. But there's no way I'm going to respect them for it.

[Gerald McGrew]

Who the hell decides their vote based on misspellings and iPhone familiarity?

[Gerald McGrew]

All completely true. When it comes to the two parties today, I would only fault the Democrats (Obama in particular, anyway) for keeping quiet until they had enough polling data indicating the shift in public opinion, rather than leading the charge on it. But sometimes such a charge can be counter-productive.

It still doesn't change the fact that conservatives are the ones who make themselves hysterical about such things, until the day comes when the opinions of the few left who still feel that way no longer matter. Just like for voting rights, desegregation, acceptance of birth control and divorce, women rising in the work force, and about a million other social issues one might care to bring up.

You're defending the ball and chain for being just a few feet behind the leg that's nevertheless dragging it along. I prefer to be a part of the leg and occasionally gripe about the ball that's holding me back. If you're the one running a race, you don't judge yourself by whether or not you've already reached the finish line or not, you judge yourself by the pace you make as you go. Note: the race we're all in has no finish line.

Absolutely I'll point out the difference between one mindset and the other, even if you don't think they amount to much. I think the difference amounts to a great deal, to a great many people.

Still, I'd say conservatives do hold a valuable place in society: they keep social progress from moving too far too fast. I think there may be some value there. But there's no way I'm going to respect them for it.

On just about every social issue, conservatives have been on the wrong side of history.

[Kristie]

Who the hell decides their vote based on misspellings and iPhone familiarity?

The same idiots that base it on biased documentaries (2016).

[Ian]

On just about every social issue, conservatives have been on the wrong side of history.

Which is why the ball and chain analogy is a good one. Were it up to (social) conservatives, there would be little or no social progress at all, just a maintenance of the status quo; hence the word conserve.

This feeling has been most expertly described by Willam F. Buckley: "A conservative is someone who stands athwart history, yelling Stop, at a time when no one is inclined to do so, or to have much patience with those who so urge it." It's a very understandable emotion - but it's also completely unrealistic, and therefore deserves little respect. History does not stop, and it never will.

All these issues like the few I listed above didn't somehow engulf liberals before conservatives by mere coincidence. That would imply that the two mindsets are standing still while culture moves about around them. No, it is because of the efforts of liberals that social progress moves in the direction it does. It is why on an issue like gay rights, when a slight majority in the US now agree with what liberals believe, that they're still not satisfied. Just because New York now allows gay marriage doesn't mean legalization in Alabama is right around the corner. The discovery and gradual spread of enlightenment simply are not enough. It's not enough until the acceptance of that enlightenment engulfs everyone, until it becomes a normal part of the human condition.

[Gerald McGrew]

Who the hell decides their vote based on misspellings and iPhone familiarity?

The same idiots that base it on biased documentaries (2016).

I actually had a friend ask me if I wanted to go see it. The thought of giving D'Souza even a penny of my money is enough to 'bout make me puke.