Shops could face legal action over 'lads' mags'

[MrJonno]

Seth wrote:

I pay extortionists in copper-jacketed lead delivered at 3000 FPS, 168 grains at a time.

And so we see the consequences of excessive reading of Tom Clancy novels...

Used to read his books when I was a lot younger until it suddenly dawned on me what crackpot propaganda it is

[JimC]

Seth wrote:

I pay extortionists in copper-jacketed lead delivered at 3000 FPS, 168 grains at a time.

And so we see the consequences of excessive reading of Tom Clancy novels...

Used to read his books when I was a lot younger until it suddenly dawned on me what crackpot propaganda it is

I actually quite like them...

But I do a kind of "fuck off, stupid ideology, just let me read the action sequences thing..."

[MrJonno]

But I do a kind of "fuck off, stupid ideology, just let me read the action sequences thing..."

Red Storm Rising was a bit of classic, but generally I don't like books or films where the hero is pure goody and the baddies is pure evil. In the real world no one thinks they are evil and only arrogant shits think they are that level of good

[JimC]

But I do a kind of "fuck off, stupid ideology, just let me read the action sequences thing..."

Red Storm Rising was a bit of classic, but generally I don't like books or films where the hero is pure goody and the baddies is pure evil. In the real world no one thinks they are evil and only arrogant shits think they are that level of good

True...

[klr]

How the hell did we get to Tom Clancy? Jim, I'm looking at you ...

[Cormac]

As mentioned by Xamanos these rights do take a while to kick in but I could sleep with my boss wife (out of office hours) and he couldnt sack me for it

If you live in the UK or Ireland, he or she could indeed fire you for that, as you will have broken the relationship of trust that sits at the heart of an employment contract.

This is a fundamental principle, and it id not overridden by employment law.

[Cormac]

You can sack someone for poor performance but you can't do it on the spot, its a set of warnings to improve and if they fail you get rid of them. Can take a few weeks to months and you need to have a proper written record of doing so. Rogering the bosses misses in the office during working hours does count as gross misconduct and would be able to get rid of them for it.

You can make a position redundant (in the UK at least) if business turns down but its the position you are making redundant not the person. Again the employer needs to put at least some justification into that.

UK employment laws are far closer to the US than any other in the EU but even they aren't on the lines I don't like someone so I can sack you crap. What sort of life would it be for an employee if employment was that unstable

This is not quite right either.

It depends on the severity of the poor performance.

If it was so poor as to completely undermine the contract, then, provided the employer follows fair procedure, they can indeed summarily dismiss the employee legally.

And, as has been pointed out, it takes some time to build up the protections offered by employment law.

Regardless of this, it would be wise of an employer to follow "fair" procedure in all cases.

[Cormac]

That too sounds like an idiotic law. Employees fucking their bosses' wives and that's not a terminable offense? It would be in a civilized country.

Redundancy is not the only reason to let an employee go. Lack of demand for product, reduced business, other economic realities, etc., all make perfect sense to let someone go. As does the fact that they just aren't performing well in their job. The whole idea that you can't sack someone unless they are committing some "gross misconduct" is ludicrous, and is probably a big reason why it may be so difficult in many jurisdictions to find employment. I mean, if I hire someone, I ought to be able to assess their performance and determine that they aren't needed. If, for example, I needed a person to perform a specific function and it turns out that they suck at it, they work too slow, or they just make too many mistakes, I ought to be able to get rid of them and replace them with another person who can actually do the job.

The sort of thing you describe sounds like a really big step backward. And, as a matter of public policy it would seem to me that it would seriously restrict new hiring of employees, because employers would have to keep a tight reign on new hiring in order to avoid locking themselves in to employees who don't cut it.

It is also perfectly reasonable for an employer to let someone go simply because they don't like the person. As a small business operator myself, I don't like the idea of having to spend my days with someone I don't like. If I hire someone to be my assistant, for example, and they rub me the wrong way, or if they just are unpleasant, I ought to be able to let them go.

Right so as a business operator you ought to be able to play with the lives of your underlings at a whim because it suits you.

Letting someone go because of reduced business etc is redundancy. And you can still fire someone for under-performing or whatever, but if you don't want to lose out to them for unfair dismissal, you're going to have be able to provide evidence, performance reviews etc, that their poor quality of work was significantly below that of someone else in the same position, significant in that it's harming the business, consistent over a period of time, and that you offered the necessary training to attempt to remedy the situation. If they really are under-performing that shouldn't be a problem.

And the suggestion that workers rights reduces the hiring of employees is nonsense. You may be right that employers have to take a more considered approach, rather than hiring and firing left, right and centre, but that just makes for more stable employment. The overall level of employment is still going to be determined by the demand for the business.

And if the bosses wife decides to sleep with someone else who happens to be one of his employees, the boss can devoice his wife, but why should he be able to fire the employee? It has nothing to do with the employees work life, and the employee might not have even know she was married.

except for the bit about adultery. That is not as straightforward.

[Svartalf]

Seth wrote:

I pay extortionists in copper-jacketed lead delivered at 3000 FPS, 168 grains at a time.

And so we see the consequences of excessive reading of Tom Clancy novels...

Are those the stats for AR15 ammo?

and why not use hollow points? FMMJ ammo is required only of military outfits, not civilians... or is it easier and cheaper to get?

[MrJonno]

As mentioned by Xamanos these rights do take a while to kick in but I could sleep with my boss wife (out of office hours) and he couldnt sack me for it

If you live in the UK or Ireland, he or she could indeed fire you for that, as you will have broken the relationship of trust that sits at the heart of an employment contract.

This is a fundamental principle, and it id not overridden by employment law.

Not convinced a relationship of trust is legally going to be affected by anything you do outside work bar exceptional circumstances. I can do anything I want politically outside work but if it encroaches on policy that my employer is involved it I have to make it very explicit that my opinions are my own. That's in my contract and isn't unreasonable.

It's the same with a creationist biology teacher who follows the curriculum in class but belongs to an organisation that rubbishes what she teaches. I certainly wouldnt trust such a person as a teacher but I don't think that's sufficient reason to sack them

[Gawdzilla Sama]

There is now a permanent underclass who no longer have manual skilled or unskilled work to do as such jobs don't exist any more. That isn't changing any time soon. Even relatively basic jobs are pretty skilled these days, my local charity shop won't 'employ' someone as a volunteer unless they are a graduate as they need to learn a large range of skills to do the job

And everybody else should be forced to labor on behalf of the indolent, lazy and wilfully uneducated why, exactly?

Because you have to live alongside them ?, its protection money and a damn good investment

I pay extortionists in copper-jacketed lead delivered at 3000 FPS, 168 grains at a time.

I pay my taxes, and the police come and arrest anyone trying extortion.
This is what normally happens in civilised countries.

Seethland isn't civilised.

[Azathoth]

I'm more with Seth on this one. You either sort it out yourself arrange for someone scarier to sort it out or pay up. Relying on the police is not going to work.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

This is just a thinly veiled attempt at censorship.

[klr]

This is just a thinly veiled attempt at censorship.

Of course it is, but if we could all agree on that, then the thread wouldn't have got past the first page ...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

This is just a thinly veiled attempt at censorship.

Of course it is, but if we could all agree on that, then the thread wouldn't have got past the first page ...

I disagree.