U.S. passes "historic" healthcare bill

[Martok]

Besides, republicans have been wrong on just about everything since 2000 ~March 4, 1929.

I would agree with that but Eisenhower & Nixon don't rank with the rest of the GOP.

For all of Nixon's faults he signed environmental protection legislation into law. Reagan and the Bush's would never have done that.

[Coito ergo sum]

So, take it from the top: 32 million people can't afford insurance now.

Actually, it's more like 45 million, but some of them speak Spanish or are non-whites, so you could give a fuck if they die in the gutter.

You know what, fuck off. This fucking bullshit about one side or the other of this debate "not caring" or "not giving a fuck" is getting very tiresome.

First of all, the language someone speaks is not determinative in the present case. They still have to buy their fucking insurance. It's a mandate to buy insurance. Don't you fucking get that? Spanish speakers are not exempted, and non-whites are not excluded. Further, spanish speakers and non-whites are not excluded now from receiving health care.

[qoute] So the government is going to make them buy it. And, everyone making more than 43,000 a year will pay for their own insurance, plus cost sharing, to the tun of $7,600 a year average! 17 million make over 50,000 a year, and obviously a whole bunch more make between 44,000 and 50,000, so they too will get no assistance.

No one under $250,000 is going to have to spend a dime more than they are now UNLESS they are voluntarily uninsured, which is the cohort that you describe above. I have NO sympathy for these people since when they DO get sick, they pass on the costs to the rest of us who choose to get health insurance.[/quote]

This idea that nobody under $250,000 is going to have to spend a dime more than they do now is a flat out lie. Provide your citation.

I think you're one of those that thinks he's immortal, indestructable, and invincible and doesn't buy health insurance.

No, I do buy it.

When you do get sick (and you will), then your plan is to dump the costs on us: i.e. the responsible insurance policy holders.

If you weren't so selfish you wouldn't mind paying. I probably make a lot less money than you.

So, no, too bad.

That's what we're overhauling the insurance system to the tune of $2.5 trillion over 10 years for?

Yeah, wow, that 2.5 trillion sounds awful. Until you realize that it's a smidgen of the defense budget...

...because nothing is expensive unless it exceeds the defense budget....

Get it yet?

I get that you're being deliberately dishonest with your figures, yes.

Me? I'll wait for your proof of this "nobody under $250,000" assertion...

And no one is eligible for welfare but haven't enrolled. That's a lie.

I didn't say welfare. I said Medicaid and SCHIP. It's not a lie.

Getting medicaid and/or SCHIP is not an easy process and usually you must be without assets that you can liquidate (such as a house or business) before you are eligible. Your canard is that you look at these people and say, well, fuck them, they should enroll in medicaid. Except they aren't eligible because they have assets even though they don't make a high salary. You would have them become destitute before they get help.

Oh, I'm sorry - people should be able to get assistance when they have the means to buy their own insurance? That's what you think?

[Coito ergo sum]

Have the political right and those bribed by the insewerance companies stopped trying to tell everyone that Obama wants to kill their granny off yet ? ..

or did that tactic not work so they are concentrating on the thing they hold dearest ie Their money .

Am I stupid and naive to think that a government should be responsible for the health of it's citizens And not profit making companies ?

The dirty tricks that these companies use to avoid paying out are well documented . Health insurance Companies are set up and run for profit not to help people !!! quess what that means ?????

Yes, they are scum.

But they can no longer avoid paying out under the new bill.

Plus, in 2017, they're pretty much fucked: http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archi ... gle+Reader

Yup, most people can't avoid paying out under the new bill. Just about everyone, except perhaps those getting the freebies, is fucked by this bill. You have that right.

[maiforpeace]

Getting medicaid and/or SCHIP is not an easy process and usually you must be without assets that you can liquidate (such as a house or business) before you are eligible. Your canard is that you look at these people and say, well, fuck them, they should enroll in medicaid. Except they aren't eligible because they have assets even though they don't make a high salary. You would have them become destitute before they get help.

Just to add to that - it's a fucking nightmare to enroll! No sick or elderly person could manage applying for either one of these and get it without the help of a full time advocate. That's why all those eligible haven't enrolled. I am the guardian of my sister who has late stage A/D and needs full time nursing care. She gets a modest annuity from my father's estate so she does have assets, but they were locked down and there was no way to liquidate them. It took nine months of arduous battling on my part and finally getting her congressperson involved to get the medicaid to cover the additional two-thirds of her expenses. In the meantime I was hassled incessantly by bill collectors, and the nursing home who literally threatened to throw her out on the street. People here on this board will attest to how stressful this was for me which really helps my hypertension. Since Medicaid is only approved on a yearly basis, I get to go through the same crap in less than a year again.

[Surendra Darathy]

There is no government healthcare in this new law. It's a legal requirement to purchase health insurance.

I'm eager to see how they implement this one. Are we now getting jailed for not having health insurance, or will we only be jailed if we get sick?

[Randydeluxe]

Besides, republicans have been wrong on just about everything since 2000 ~March 4, 1929.

I would agree with that but Eisenhower & Nixon don't rank with the rest of the GOP.

For all of Nixon's faults he signed environmental protection legislation into law. Reagan and the Bush's would never have done that.

Oh I can find all sorts of things to approve of. Just taking the two Bushes:

George H. W. Bush was arguably the most fiscally responsible President of the 20th century. It cost him a second term, and he stood on principle rather than take the easy and wrong path to reelection.

George W. Bush created the largest fully protected marine wildlife preserve in the world. His deserves a gold star in his legacy for it, as it represents an area roughly the size of California, and he claimed to be passionately moved to do so after seeing Jean-Michel Cousteau's film Voyage to Kure.

[Valden]

There is no government healthcare in this new law. It's a legal requirement to purchase health insurance.

I'm eager to see how they implement this one. Are we now getting jailed for not having health insurance, or will we only be jailed if we get sick?

They'll be fined (highest being $2,084 for families, or 2.8% of income)
If they don't pay the fine, off the jail. But really, it's just cheaper to pay the fine then get private insurance.

[SamanthaJane]

Gawd I really wish you guys down south would get this worked out. Not only are you not getting decent healthcare, you are paying through the nose for it.

I'm hopeful that this bill fixes that.

Canada might have wait times for non urgent surgeries, but I still feel much much safer here than I do in the US, even though my healthcare covers any issues I may have in the US.

[Surendra Darathy]

There is no government healthcare in this new law. It's a legal requirement to purchase health insurance.

I'm eager to see how they implement this one. Are we now getting jailed for not having health insurance, or will we only be jailed if we get sick?

They'll be fined (highest being $2,084 for families, or 2.8% of income)
If they don't pay the fine, off the jail. But really, it's just cheaper to pay the fine then get private insurance.

Well, you're talking about taxable income. Those who are able to shield their income will be paying about $28 bucks a year in fines. Even they will still be complaining that the situation sucks.

Of course it will, in the long run, be more expensive if you get sick. Americans are a nation of riverboat gamblers and sharks who deal from the bottom of the deck. The chickens are coming home to roost. The bats are in the belfry.

[Coito ergo sum]

There is no government healthcare in this new law. It's a legal requirement to purchase health insurance.

I'm eager to see how they implement this one. Are we now getting jailed for not having health insurance, or will we only be jailed if we get sick?

You'll have to disclosure your health insurance information when you file your tax return, and if you don't have it you'll pay a fine (potential for jail time exist down the road).

[Coito ergo sum]

This email is making the rounds - kinda funny:

Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health
care plan written by a committee whose chairman says
he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't
read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a
president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay
his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is
obese, and financed by a country that's broke.

What could possibly go wrong?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

This whole thing is very amusing for a historian. I've recently been reading the speeches made about Social Security in the 1930s. Same nonsense, different day. Absolute guarantees the SSA would destroy America. Dire warning and extreme alarm.

Santayana would be amused.

[Wumbologist]

This email is making the rounds - kinda funny:

Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health
care plan written by a committee whose chairman says
he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't
read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a
president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay
his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is
obese, and financed by a country that's broke.

What could possibly go wrong?

The President smokes? Oh no!
Well, since we can't get him on the whole birth certificate thing, maybe we can impeach him on that?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

This email is making the rounds - kinda funny:

Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health
care plan written by a committee whose chairman says
he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't
read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a
president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay
his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is
obese, and financed by a country that's broke.

What could possibly go wrong?

The President smokes? Oh no!
Well, since we can't get him on the whole birth certificate thing, maybe we can impeach him on that?

Charge him with "Smoking While Black"?

[Martok]

This email is making the rounds - kinda funny:

Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health
care plan written by a committee whose chairman says
he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't
read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a
president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay
his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is
obese, and financed by a country that's broke.

What could possibly go wrong?

Its broke because the political party in control for eight of the last ten years broke it.

Now they want us to listen to them again. Yeah right.