Oslo Blast Gun Derail

[Gallstones]

Ban fertilizer.

I wouldn't go that far. I don't agree with all of your comments, but I defend your right to make them.

• 

[Seth]

Ban neo-nazi libertarian shits starting with a few on this forum. They wanted dead socialists and how they have a 100 of them. Fucking animals and their cult of individiuality

Ban neo-Marxist shits starting with a few on this forum. They want dead libertarians and they have 100 million of them in this century. Fucking animals and their cult of collectivism.

[Gallstones]

Seth isn't spewing Libertarian bullshit.
Just because Seth says it does not mean it is Libertarian.

He spewed a lot of compassion as well.

"spewed" being the operative term.

I realize you have a personal loathing for Seth, but compassion is compassion and there are no bad versions.

Not even faux compassion?

Why assume there has been faux compassion?
By definition it would not be compassion then.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Why assume there has been faux compassion?

It's the only kind I could imagine Seth having.

By definition it would not be compassion then.

Exactly.

[amok]

The headline to one of the news articles I read went like this, "Norway police arrive 90 minutes after firing began."

An hour and a half.

A person can kill a lot of people in an hour and a half.

The headline is wrong.

From the police got the message of shooting till Breivik was captured it took an hour.

The police can not save you. They just investigate the aftermath.

Bull.

In this particular incident, how many people did they save?

I heard early on that there were about 700 people on the island, but I can't find that number in any of the more recent reports.

[Seth]

Humans are primates prone to violence and abusing one another. That is the Problem. It isn't fists or sticks or clubs or knives or fertilizer, or gasoline or guns.

The issue is impulse killing, I think. It's a lot harder to kill someone with a knife on impulse than it is to pull the .32 out from a purse and peg that bitch that is sitting with your man at the bar. So I believe that guns facilitate violence rather than cause it.

Someone who is deranged enough to murder another person will find a way to do it with or without a gun, and the best defense against someone who is attacking you with murderous intent is a gun.

And no, it's not harder to kill someone with a knife, it's far easier and more sure. I'd much rather face someone armed with a handgun than a knife because they are harder to use, require some skill to produce a killing shot, and are more easily evaded.

Someone with a knife doesn't need any training to slash your throat in a heartbeat, and it's much harder to defend against a knife attack and serious to fatal injuries are much more likely.

You see, most criminals, and particularly people who may illegally carry, but never train with a gun, are notoriously bad shots. They hit their targets far less than half the time, and when they do, only 15 percent of the time is the shot fatal.

One slash from a knife to the throat or brachial artery in the upper arm, or a stab wound to the heart or even abdomen can easily cause you to bleed to death before anyone can help you.

[MrJonno]

Ban neo-nazi libertarian shits starting with a few on this forum. They wanted dead socialists and how they have a 100 of them. Fucking animals and their cult of individiuality

Ban neo-Marxist shits starting with a few on this forum. They want dead libertarians and they have 100 million of them in this century. Fucking animals and their cult of collectivism.

Luckily the only thing individuals can murder are children and the people in the end will always defeat these sociopaths

[Warren Dew]

I'm absolutely sure there is going to be a total crack down on seth like ideology all over Europe after this (and no we won't be giving school kids uzi's to defend themselves)

I am rapt with anticipation in being able to watch this unfold.
It will be fascinating.

As long as it stays on the far side of the Atlantic, as it did in the 1930s, maybe.

I realize you have a personal loathing for Seth, but compassion is compassion and there are no bad versions.

Not even faux compassion?

I'd say even true compassion can be bad, for example when it leads to the kind of counterproductive dictatorial policies that MrJonno suggests.

[Gallstones]

Seth makes me puke. 87 kids are dead and he makes it an opportunity to spew his libertarian bullshit. He should be ashamed of himself.

That's a bit of an overreaction, isn't it? He's suggesting what he thinks would have saved lives. The fact that his opinion on that differs makes you "puke?"

Some people are emotional about these things. Overly so.

I think it's a natural reaction to making political hay out of other people's misfortune. It shows that no harm is to grievous for some folks to fail to try and score points off it.

Misfortunes of this magnitude are issues of broad concern.
Why would people not talk about it?
We talk about problems to solve them. We talk about grief and shock and outrage to relieve ourselves of them.
There would be no discussion at all and no searching, nor discovery of solutions if everybody just felt the same about everything.
No one is totally right nor totally wrong.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Why would people not talk about it?
We talk about problems to solve them. We talk about grief and shock and outrage to relieve ourselves of them.
There would be no discussion at all and no searching, nor discovery of solutions if everybody just felt the same about everything.
No one is totally right nor totally wrong.

I didn't force that persona on Seth, he created it. He can live with it.

[Gallstones]

Ban neo-nazi libertarian shits starting with a few on this forum. They wanted dead socialists and how they have a 100 of them. Fucking animals and their cult of individiuality

No one wanted anyone to be dead.

The level of ignorance and intolerance you expressed above would embarrass any decent, sensible human being.
You are little different from the caricature you have created of those you fear and hate. It is irrational.

There has been constant calling for the death of 'marxists' and 'socialists' on this forum, there is going to be a complete crack down on these far right groups in the near future.

Or to put it another way if anyone doesntt want to be part of society (or if they prefer the 'collective') leave or die

• 

I don't think I can take you seriously.

[Seth]

Plenty of other ways to make explosives, you might want to shut down the internet, burn all chemistry books and shoot all the chemists first.

Valid point.

Of course, the point is equally valid about guns, as Seth pointed out:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1376982.stm

They are not equivalent, however. You have to be in physical contact with a person to use a knife, unless you want to throw it away of course. Charles Whittman on the Texas Tower with a knife is a quite different matter than him with a box of guns.

Evidently it's necessary to point out that Whitman was kept from killing more people by CIVILIANS shooting at him with their private hunting rifles because the police had no long-range rifles in their arsenal, and moreover, an ARMED CIVILIAN with a shotgun was part of the courageous final assault on Whitman that killed him.

It's also necessary to point out that in China, a deranged man with a knife killed more children (32 I believe) in a pre-school before anyone could stop him, which doubles Whitman's score.

I believe a similar knife/sword attack on a school took place in Japan as well.

So, you're wrong. Again.

Deranged murderers bent on mass killing will find both a vulnerable population to target and a weapon capable of doing the job even in the absence of guns. Like, for example. glass jugs of jellied gasoline and a lighter.

And the only reasonable and effective defense against such attacks is someone armed with a firearm who can take out the killer as quickly as possible.

Dunblane, Scotland is an excellent example of both of these principles. Armed with a handgun, the killer shot and killed 17 people, firing more than 100 rounds. He could have accomplished the same thing with jars of gasoline mixed with powdered laundry detergent.

The key is that no one had a firearm with which to oppose and distract him from his intended targets. Had one or more teachers or administrators been carrying a concealed firearm, things might have turned out differently. The same is true at Columbine, where teachers were using fire extinguishers as ad hoc weapons while trying to defend students.

The point is that killers will kill, and they will find a weapon to use regardless of "bans" of any sort because they are killers and don't obey weapons bans. This makes it necessary for the citizenry to be armed so that they can stop such attacks, irrespective of the weapon being used, as quickly as possible. The more armed citizens in the community, the more likely that one of them will be in a position to act.

[Gallstones]

I don't want your fucking guns.
"Come get 'em" sounds a little like impulse hostility. Good thing you have no guns just laying around.

It's a challenge. You want my guns, you come and take them away from me. Good luck with that. Don't send married men.

So only people like you should be allowed to have them?

One of us just said something stupid.

You.
You seem overly emotional about your guns.
Is that level of defensiveness warranted?

[Seth]

Ban neo-nazi libertarian shits starting with a few on this forum. They wanted dead socialists and how they have a 100 of them. Fucking animals and their cult of individiuality

Ban neo-Marxist shits starting with a few on this forum. They want dead libertarians and they have 100 million of them in this century. Fucking animals and their cult of collectivism.

Luckily the only thing individuals can murder are children and the people in the end will always defeat these sociopaths

Yes, the people will in the end defeat sociopathic neo-Marxists, and yes, sociopathic neo-Marxists are indeed only capable of using terror tactics against their enemies because they are cowards who are afraid to face a free and armed people determined to defeat them.

We agree on something it seems...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Sorry Seeth, but I wasn't wrong, you just misrepresented what I said again.