Man forced to stand on 7 hr. flight due to obese neighbor.

[hadespussercats]

There is TREMENDOUS pressure on airlines to not delay. As long as they push back from the gate, they can boast another 'on time departure' (even if they let you stew on the ramp for another 8 hours)

The counter staff are at fault, along with a shitty system which can fail in this manner.

There was a flight a few years ago here, where a bunch of fat good-old-boys got on a plane to go fishing. They all weighed considerably more than was allotted for an 'average passenger', and the pilot didn't twig.

Flipped the plane over in Yellowknife Bay. Good fucking thing no-one died (that time)

As to the FAs' moving, no. They have specific roles which are more important than a fat guys comfort. Or a skinny guys. Leave them right where they are. Oh, and do everyone a favour and obey them as if your life depends on it, in the event of an emergency.

Oh, I agree-- the counter staff should have caught the issue before the man boarded. But since they didn't, the FAs were the last line of defense.

I didn't realize the FAs' primary purpose was to sit in their seats. I agree that generally passengers shouldn't sit in the FA seats, but that general rule ought to bend when you have a passenger who can't sit anywhere else. A FA often stands throughout a flight, and is trained to do so, if required by circumstance. I think this was one of those circumstances.

Of course, maybe the non-obese man actually could have sat, but didn't want to be uncomfortable, and decided to kick up a fuss instead. We don't really know.

[Cunt]

Oh, I agree-- the counter staff should have caught the issue before the man boarded. But since they didn't, the FAs were the last line of defense.

I didn't realize the FAs' primary purpose was to sit in their seats.

Not exactly, but to serve their purpose, they should remain in their seats. They are there to help disoriented passengers climb out quickly in the event of an emergency. Because of this, I would say leave them where they are.

I agree that generally passengers shouldn't sit in the FA seats, but that general rule ought to bend when you have a passenger who can't sit anywhere else.

I quite disagree, but you may not have taken the rescue element into account.

A FA often stands throughout a flight, and is trained to do so, if required by circumstance. I think this was one of those circumstances.

I have not seen one stand through take-off or landing, but I admit my experience is limited to occasional flying and working for a few airlines, small and smaller.

Of course, maybe the non-obese man actually could have sat, but didn't want to be uncomfortable, and decided to kick up a fuss instead. We don't really know.

The plane could not legally take off with a passenger in the aisle, so he fit in that seat at least at the start.
I suppose the flight crew could have let him stand throughout, but I seriously doubt it.
If I were the flight attendant, I would have ordered him back to his seat when the pilots turned on the seat-belt sign, and advised the flight deck if he refused.

You can joke around and call flight attendants 'cookie-pushers', but if your flight has landed on water, you might want to just do what they fucking tell you. Fast. They push cookies true enough, but few have died due to a lack of cookie

[Seth]

There was a flight a few years ago here, where a bunch of fat good-old-boys got on a plane to go fishing. They all weighed considerably more than was allotted for an 'average passenger', and the pilot didn't twig.

Incompetent fuck. Every light-plane pilot knows you have to actually weigh stuff, load it correctly and do a weight-and-balance calculation...or you die.

Flipped the plane over in Yellowknife Bay. Good fucking thing no-one died (that time)

No kidding.

As to the FAs' moving, no. They have specific roles which are more important than a fat guys comfort. Or a skinny guys. Leave them right where they are. Oh, and do everyone a favour and obey them as if your life depends on it, in the event of an emergency.

And the regs require that EVERYONE, including FAs be seated and seat belted during landing and takeoff.

[Cunt]

There was a flight a few years ago here, where a bunch of fat good-old-boys got on a plane to go fishing. They all weighed considerably more than was allotted for an 'average passenger', and the pilot didn't twig.

Incompetent fuck. Every light-plane pilot knows you have to actually weigh stuff, load it correctly and do a weight-and-balance calculation...or you die.

Yup. There is also horrendous pressure on these (usually young, inexperienced) pilots to get shit done.

I blame the pilot, but also suggest that you try it.

He may have been competant and just too cowardly to refuse a job.

Or too greedy because they base pay on hours flying.

Flipped the plane over in Yellowknife Bay. Good fucking thing no-one died (that time)

No kidding.

A bunch of boaters responded immediately, or someone would have.

[Seth]

There was a flight a few years ago here, where a bunch of fat good-old-boys got on a plane to go fishing. They all weighed considerably more than was allotted for an 'average passenger', and the pilot didn't twig.

Incompetent fuck. Every light-plane pilot knows you have to actually weigh stuff, load it correctly and do a weight-and-balance calculation...or you die.

Yup. There is also horrendous pressure on these (usually young, inexperienced) pilots to get shit done.

True enough.

I blame the pilot, but also suggest that you try it.

Been there, done that, have the tee-shirt. Commercial multi-engine land, instrument, two type-certificates, Convair 440 (flew Jerry Lewis to Grand Cayman once), and King Air, haven't flown since my own plane crash though (nothing to do with weight-and-balance, just an unfortunate wind shift at touchdown in my Maule M4 during short-field, off-airport landing practice that cause me to catch a wing-tip and cartwheel), can't get a medical any more.

[/quote]A bunch of boaters responded immediately, or someone would have.[/quote]

Being fat probably helped. Fat people float...

[Cunt]

I blame the pilot, but also suggest that you try it.

Been there, done that, have the tee-shirt. Commercial multi-engine land, instrument, two type-certificates, Convair 440 (flew Jerry Lewis to Grand Cayman once), and King Air, haven't flown since my own plane crash though (nothing to do with weight-and-balance, just an unfortunate wind shift at touchdown in my Maule M4 during short-field, off-airport landing practice that cause me to catch a wing-tip and cartwheel), can't get a medical any more.

I wish you were still working in aviation. When someone leaves with that kind of experience, they take it with them. It is an industry where I prefer to see a lot of grey hairs around.

Being fat probably helped. Fat people float...

I don't know...YOU try pulling a fat fuck out through the door of a 185. Upside-down. In a sub-arctic lake. Okay, I don't know if it was upside-down...and it couldn't have been a 185 because there were a few people and gear...I can't find the story now. But I think it would be tough, even if it was your own fat ass you were rescuing.

Bet there was a good flight attendant

EDIT - to fix quotes

[Seth]

I blame the pilot, but also suggest that you try it.

Been there, done that, have the tee-shirt. Commercial multi-engine land, instrument, two type-certificates, Convair 440 (flew Jerry Lewis to Grand Cayman once), and King Air, haven't flown since my own plane crash though (nothing to do with weight-and-balance, just an unfortunate wind shift at touchdown in my Maule M4 during short-field, off-airport landing practice that cause me to catch a wing-tip and cartwheel), can't get a medical any more.

I wish you were still working in aviation. When someone leaves with that kind of experience, they take it with them. It is an industry where I prefer to see a lot of grey hairs around.

Thanks. I like to say that airline pilots don't really earn $150,000 a year or whatever, they, like Captain Sully, earn all of it all at once when something goes horribly wrong.

Being fat probably helped. Fat people float...

I don't know...YOU try pulling a fat fuck out through the door of a 185. Upside-down. In a sub-arctic lake. Okay, I don't know if it was upside-down...and it couldn't have been a 185 because there were a few people and gear...I can't find the story now. But I think it would be tough, even if it was your own fat ass you were rescuing.

Well, I was assuming they got out on their own, in which case a good cast and some stout leader allows you to just troll them to shore...

[Warren Dew]

Well, as we both have pointed out, there are large portions of the story missing. But the attendants could have noted the seating difficulty before take-off and delayed the flight until the problem was resolved one way or another-- finding a passenger who'd willingly be bumped, for instance. Or getting the obese man on to another flight where there was room.

I believe the article said the fat man was the last one on board. Likely the gate staff called the flight staff to see if there was an empty seat, a flight attendant noted the one empty seat, and they put him on board and shut the door before he even made it to the seat. And then he sat down, so as far as safety regulations were concerned, it seems everyone was seated for takeoff.

Federal regulations say that if you don't shut the door in time or if you reopen it, you lose your takeoff slot. Then everyone on the plane may get to wait for half an hour or an hour. I don't fault the flight attendants - or rather the pilot, who would make the decision in that case - for refusing to inconvenience all the other passengers to fix this one issue - not to mention it might not have been so easy to get the fat person to get off once he was on.

Or even failing that, I'd like to know why the illegality of the standing passenger sitting in one of the attendants' seats trumps the illegality of him flying without restraints at takeoff or landing. I mean, I realize that generally passengers don't sit in attendants' seats, but generally passengers have seats of their own they can sit in. And the attendants are being paid to be on that plane, and attend to the needs of passengers. Quite a contrast to the passenger who paid to sit, but wasn't allowed to.

The flight attendants are required to be sitting during takeoff and landing, too, so there wouldn't have been a free flight attendant seat available. The flight attendant seats are usually folded up out of the way for the rest of the flight to provide room for the flight attendants to do their jobs. Again, there were another hundred or two hundred passengers who also needed to get taken care of. Given that the thin guy complained about being unable to buckle his seat belt during takeoff and landing, my bet is that he was at least in his seat.

The counter staff are at fault, along with a shitty system which can fail in this manner.

The counter staff and the gate staff. If a flight attendant was working the gate, he or she could get some of the blame, but not as a flight attendant.

[Cunt]

Thanks. I like to say that airline pilots don't really earn $150,000 a year or whatever, they, like Captain Sully, earn all of it all at once when something goes horribly wrong.

It IS fun to say, but not really true.

I think Sully earned his pay every time he went for training rather than doing something else. The day his plane made the special landing, he simply did what anyone should do - used all his ability to save his ass, and those around him.

His abilities were honed a bit better than average, but that sleepy Saturday morning in a classroom likely didn't feel like heroism...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Thanks. I like to say that airline pilots don't really earn $150,000 a year or whatever, they, like Captain Sully, earn all of it all at once when something goes horribly wrong.

It IS fun to say, but not really true.

I think Sully earned his pay every time he went for training rather than doing something else. The day his plane made the special landing, he simply did what anyone should do - used all his ability to save his ass, and those around him.

His abilities were honed a bit better than average, but that sleepy Saturday morning in a classroom likely didn't feel like heroism...

Sully had been training other pilots for years, IIRC. His co-pilots were always in a classroom when he had the left-hand seat. It's good to know there are guys like him making pilots smarter.

And one more time, thank you, Sully, for not thanking god.

[kiki5711]

I also blame the airline for making the seating space smaller each time I get on the plane it seems like that is the case. I feel squashed. I'm tall and have nowhere to put my legs and I always ask for isle seat cause that way I can at least stretch them sideways. If you're not in "first class" which I'm never in, you have do deal with small space seats. It use to not be like that.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I also blame the airline for making the seating space smaller each time I get on the plane it seems like that is the case. I feel squashed. I'm tall and have nowhere to put my legs and I always ask for isle seat cause that way I can at least stretch them sideways. If you're not in "first class" which I'm never in, you have do deal with small space seats. It use to not be like that.

"Sardine Airlines would like to welcome you to Flight 666 to Hellnback. I "like" because actually we don't give a damn. If you want your fucking peanuts you'll sit quietly and wait for us to get done giving the pilots blow jobs. And no, we won't wash our hands before serving you."

[kiki5711]

I also blame the airline for making the seating space smaller each time I get on the plane it seems like that is the case. I feel squashed. I'm tall and have nowhere to put my legs and I always ask for isle seat cause that way I can at least stretch them sideways. If you're not in "first class" which I'm never in, you have do deal with small space seats. It use to not be like that.

"Sardine Airlines would like to welcome you to Flight 666 to Hellnback. I "like" because actually we don't give a damn. If you want your fucking peanuts you'll sit quietly and wait for us to get done giving the pilots blow jobs. And no, we won't wash our hands before serving you."

I can still remember when you got served a meal even on a 2 hr flight, and baggage, or pillows, or ear thingies for music did NOT cost extra and the seats were more comfortable. I guess I'm really getting old. So much has changed.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I also blame the airline for making the seating space smaller each time I get on the plane it seems like that is the case. I feel squashed. I'm tall and have nowhere to put my legs and I always ask for isle seat cause that way I can at least stretch them sideways. If you're not in "first class" which I'm never in, you have do deal with small space seats. It use to not be like that.

"Sardine Airlines would like to welcome you to Flight 666 to Hellnback. I "like" because actually we don't give a damn. If you want your fucking peanuts you'll sit quietly and wait for us to get done giving the pilots blow jobs. And no, we won't wash our hands before serving you."

I can still remember when you got served a meal even on a 2 hr flight, and baggage, or pillows, or ear thingies for music did NOT cost extra and the seats were more comfortable. I guess I'm really getting old. So much has changed.

In flight movies. Okay, lame movies, but still...

[Seth]

I also blame the airline for making the seating space smaller each time I get on the plane it seems like that is the case. I feel squashed. I'm tall and have nowhere to put my legs and I always ask for isle seat cause that way I can at least stretch them sideways. If you're not in "first class" which I'm never in, you have do deal with small space seats. It use to not be like that.

I won't fly anything but business or first class for that very reason, if I fly at all. Frankly, I'd rather spend four days driving from Colorado to Kentucky that book an airline flight, and I'd rather rent a stateroom on a cruise ship across the Atlantic than fly.

I've had a couple of really, really miserable experiences with seats on aircraft because I'm outside the 85th percentile (or whatever they use to build seats these days). I'm not obese, just big and tall. On one flight I booked a bulkhead seat knowing I needed the extra leg room, only to find that the bulkhead seats had the tray table in the armrest, making the seat a full three inches narrower than a standard coach seat. I could not physically get my ass into the seat, it was too narrow for my pelvis bones, so I ended up back in coach, with my knees jammed up against the seat in front so tightly I couldn't lean back (and the forward passenger couldn't recline his seat at all) and spent the whole three hours with my head against the back of the other seat. I had bruises on my knees for weeks.

It's annoying not to be able to buy a cheap seat, but as a Libertarian I accept the fact that in an aircraft, seat space is a commodity and the airlines have a perfect right to charge more for more seat space. So, I either pay for the space I want, or I don't fly.