Blind groper wrote:Seth
The plural of anecdote is not data.
Recitations of facts are not "anecdotes.
If I wanted to use anecdotes for "evidence", I have 8,000 hand gun murders per year in the USA to post one by one.
Who cares what you want? Besides, I accept your figures, whereas you refuse to accept the fact that ANYBODY ever uses their gun in lawful self defense. So, I post factual examples of exactly that happening to rebut your silly notion.
That would not change the argument one iota, of course. Easier just to tell you of 8,000 hand gun murders each year in the USA.
It's easier to tell you about the 2.5 million lawful DGUs each year in the USA, but since you don't believe they happen, I choose to post the occasional factual report showing that DGUs do, in fact, occur with regularity.
However, your repeated posting of anecdotes is just another indication that you have no idea of what represents evidence and what is just bullshit.
Facts are not anecdotes.
I have posted evidence in the form of comparisons between countries and the clear cut correlation between ownership of firearms and murder rates. You disdain this because you actually have no idea of what makes good evidence. Good statistics are the most powerful evidence we have, until the government of the USA stops being a bunch of total idiots and permits good data on ownership of guns to be collected.
That little girl's life is not a statistic, it's her absolute and undeniable right to stay alive and to use a gun to fend of a home invader if necessary, and all your statistical bullshit isn't worth a single hair on that girl's head. According to your argument, if she'd been raped and murdered in Australia that would be just fine with you, so long as she didn't have access to a gun. So go fuck yourself.
You claim you cannot feel safe without a gun.
Liar. I've never said that. Not ever.
Come to NZ, or Australia, or the UK. You will be safe without a gun, because other people do not have guns.
Liar. No, I amend that, you are a fucking lying sack of shit:
Is Australia staring down the barrel of a gun crisis?
1 year ago August 02, 2013 10:02AM
In the seven years from 2005 to 2012, gun murders across Australia almost doubled. The incidence of guns used in kidnappings trebled. The total number of crimes in which a firearm was used rose from 823 in 2005, to 1217 in 2012, an increase of 47 per cent. Source: News Limited (emphasis added)
THERE is a gun battle going on in Australia. As bikie gang members and drug dealers gun each other down on a regular basis, sending fear through the community, authorities seem to be fighting a losing battle to keep firearms out of their hands.
Without scaremongering, here are the facts:
* There have been 39 people shot in Sydney this year, most related to an ongoing bikie war.
* Conservative estimates say there are more than a quarter-of-a-million illegal firearms in Australia.
* Gun ownership in Australia is back at pre-Port Arthur massacre levels.
* Carrying a gun is becoming more common and ingrained in outlaw culture.
* Gun amnesties barely put a dent in the number of weapons.
* Innocent people are being caught up in gun battles.
* There has been a steady increase in gun-related crimes over the past seven years.
But ..
* Our rate of gun-related deaths is decreasing. Latest figures show guns account for just 1.06 deaths per 100,000 compared to 10.3 per 100,000 in the United States.
So far this year, there have been 39 people shot on Sydney's streets. Fourteen of those were in July. Two men were shot dead this week. One had survived another shooting just days before being killed.
The carnage has prompted NSW Police Commissioner Andrew Scipione to call for judges to impose tougher sentences for gun crime, saying some offenders are getting off with fines.
fatal shooting
Police at the scene where 35-year-old Vasko Boskovski was shot dead at his home in Sydney. There has been a sharp spike in shootings.
And Federal Home Affairs Minister Jason Clare is worried about the threat to innocent bystanders.
Mr Clare told an organised crime conference in Brisbane this week: "I'm worried that a day will come when an innocent person is caught in the crossfire, where an innocent person is shot and not a member of an outlaw motorcycle gang.''
That's already happened. More than once.
Truck driver Barry Knight was killed by a stray bullet as he drove past a shootout in Sydney's southwest in June 2009.
The gunshots were fired during a fight between a group of men in the car park of a KFC in Milperra Road, Milperra - scene of the infamous Father's Day massacre in 1984.
Just this week, an innocent bystander was shot in one of the main streets of Launceston in what police believe was a bungled revenge attack for a shooting in May.
Isaak Heathcote, 19, had just left an internet cafe on Monday night when he was hit by a stray bullet fired from a moving car.
It's the second incident in Launceston this year. A 34-year-old man was permanently disabled after being shot in the back in Launceston in March as he walked home from work.
In March, a man standing in his front garden was struck in the neck by a shotgun pellet during a drive-by shooting in Adelaide's northern suburbs.
The man was in the front yard of a house, two doors down from the targeted property in Elizabeth Grove, when the shotgun was fired in his direction. His injuries were not life-threatening.
Last year, a 53-year-old woman was shot in the buttocks when she was caught in the crossfire as a bikie opened fire on a rival gang member in a packed shopping centre on the Gold Coast.
Hundreds of shoppers ran for their lives while shopkeepers closed stores and cowered behind counters with customers as shots rang out outside a phone shop near popular Robina Town Centre's busy food court and cinema complex.
Daylight shooting
Crime experts say there has been a change in behaviour among outlaws.
One former counter terrorism officer, who spoke to The Australian and asked not to be named, said the gun culture had become so ingrained among Middle Eastern males in southwest Sydney that they have taken to settling so-called "honour'' disputes with guns.
"The culture is all guns and drugs. If someone looks at your wife the wrong way, you shoot them. They think they're bulletproof and they have this wilful disregard for authority.''
Police figures show that in the 2012-2013 financial year 9506 illegal firearms were seized, 729 of them handguns.
Handguns, particularly the semi-automatic Glock, are the criminal's weapon of choice.
Figures from the Australian Bureau of Statistics show that firearms are being used more often in crime.
In the seven years from 2005 to 2012, gun murders across Australia almost doubled. The incidence of guns used in kidnappings trebled. The total number of crimes in which a firearm was used rose from 823 in 2005, to 1217 in 2012, an increase of 47 per cent.
The figures look bad, but 2005 was an unusual year, with gun crime at a record low. Numbers of gun-related crimes had fallen in the preceding years before bottoming out and rising again.
Total gun crimes in 2012 were 1217, compared to 1107 in 2011.
Gun amnesties in various states have had mixed results.
Gun amnesties in various states have had mixed results.
This year, it seems to be getting worse.
In the last month there have been 13 serious shooting incidents reported in south-western Sydney.
Adelaide experienced a burst of gun activity early this year with 14 people shot in January and February.
In other incidents:
* In the NT, a car chase through Darwin ended in a volley of gunshots when a woman fired at a woman in another car. Two people were wounded.
* In Queensland this year, a woman was shot in the hip at Carrara, a man in the face at Upper Mount Gravatt and a man in the leg at Kedron in three separate incidents.
* In Victoria, once the state with an appalling reputation for gun crime, there have been relatively few incidents this year, though a bikie clubhouse was shot up in June.
Latest figures from the Australian Crime Commission estimate there are more than 260,000 illegal firearms in Australia. Other studies put the number as high as half-a-million.
Amnesties and dob-in campaigns barely scratch the surface.
NSW police figures show there have been 271 weapons seized up to mid-May.
In May, the Australia New Zealand Policing Advisory Agency (ANZPAA), launched Operation Unification, a joint initiative of police agencies across Australia to get illicit firearms out of the hands of criminals.
In the two weeks of the operation, 110 firearms were seized and 52 people arrested.
This week, the WA government has launched a gun buyback scheme in a bid to get weapons off the streets.
Last year in SA, about 3000 firearms were handed in during an amnesty.
A three-month amnesty in Queensland this year netted 19,000 weapons - one of the most successful hauls since the Howard governments buyback in the 1990s.
But it still leaves hundreds of thousands of illegal weapons out there.
As one crime expert said: "Crims don't hand in their guns."
But "at least it takes a few more guns off the streets," another official said.
The Australian Institute of Criminology estimates around 1500 firearms are stolen each year, the majority of which are rifles and shotguns, with few of these recovered.
In its most recent national intelligence assessment of the illicit firearm market in 2012, the Australian Crime Commission said the durability of firearms ensured those sold illegally remain in circulation for many decades.
The oldest firearm traced by the ACC was a functioning revolver manufactured in 1888.
As for illegal weapons brought in from overseas, more than 4000 guns, parts and magazines were seized by Customs between 2008-11. But authorities admit it is unknown how many are not detected.
In a bid to combat illegal firearms, $9.1 million will be spent to establish a national electronic ballistics network for police.
The project, run by CrimTrac, will establish an Australian Ballistics Identification Network (ABIN). It will "support police activities to address illegal firearms by providing national, state and territory law enforcement agencies with advanced technology to undertake ballistics analysis of firearms."
The idea is to have a database of every weapon recovered by police from crimes. It will be available to every police service to compare and collect the images. The system, is due to be up and running by July 2014.
###
Cullin-La-Ringo massacre - Horatio Wills and his traveling party were killed by Aborigines at Cullin-La-Ringo Station in Queensland in 1860; police, native police and civilians killed 60 to 70 Aborigines in response.
George David Silva murdered six members of the Ching family at Alligator Creek near Mackay, Queensland in 1911.
Coniston massacre - Over 50 Aboriginal people were killed in the last Aboriginal massacre in 1928. The motive was revenge for the killing of dingo hunter Frederick Brooks.
Hope Forest massacre - Clifford Cecil Bartholomew shot dead ten members of his family in Hope Forest near Adelaide, September 1971.[2]
22 September 1976 - William Robert Wilson - Killed two people and wounded four on Boundary Street, Spring Hill, Brisbane. Wilson took a .22 calibre rifle and 500 rounds of ammunition to Boundary Street around 12.30 pm and began shooting randomly. He shot and killed Monika Schleus, aged 17, as she crossed Boundary Street. Wilson shot and wounded Donald William Hepburn Galloway, who was also crossing the street. Proceeding to a milk bar, Wilson shot and killed Marianne Kalatzis, aged 18, and wounded Mavis Ethel Sanders and Virginia Hollidge. In the neighbouring shop he shot and wounded Quinto Alberti. Wilson was captured by police around 4:15 pm at a suburban house where Wilson was holding a man and four young women hostage. Wilson served three years in a mental hospital. On being found fit for trial, he was sentenced in 1980 to two life sentences for the murders and 10 years each, concurrently, for the four attempted murders. He pleaded guilty to all charges.[3]
Milperra massacre - Two biker gangs, the Comanchero and the Bandidos, engaged in a shoot-out in a hotel car park, killing 7 people in 1984, including a bystander. Only one defendant was acquitted on the murder charges.
Joseph Schwab - 1987, Schwab shot dead 5 people in and around the Kimberley region in Western Australia before being shot dead by police.[4]
Hoddle Street massacre - Armed with two rifles and a shotgun, Julian Knight shot 7 people dead and wounded another 19 in 1987 before surrendering to authorities.
Queen Street massacre - Armed with a sawn-off rifle, Frank Vitkovic roamed the Australia Post building killing 8 and wounding 5, also in 1987. When the weapon was finally wrestled from him, he committed suicide by jumping out of a nearby window.
Surry Hills massacre - Paul Anthony Evers killed 5 people with a 12-gauge shotgun at a public housing precinct in Surry Hills in 1990 before surrendering to police.[5]
Strathfield massacre - In 1991 Wade Frankum killed 7 people and wounded 6 others with a large knife and an SKS before turning the gun on himself when he realised he could not escape.
Central Coast Massacre - Malcolm Baker killed 6 people and injured another with a shotgun in 1992 before being arrested by police.
Port Arthur massacre - In 1996, armed with two semi-automatic rifles, Martin Bryant killed 35 people around Port Arthur and wounded 21 before being caught by police the next day following an overnight siege.
Childers Palace Fire - In June 2000, drifter and con-artist Robert Long started a fire at the Childers Palace backpackers hostel that killed 15 people.
Monash University shooting - In October 2002, Huan Yun Xiang, a student, shot his classmates and teacher, killing two and injuring five.
Churchill Fire - 10 confirmed deaths due to a deliberately lit fire. The fire was lit on 7 February 2009.[6]
2011 Hectorville siege - A mass shooting that took place on Friday, April 29, 2011, in Hectorville, South Australia. It began after a 39-year-old male, Donato Anthony Corbo, went on a shooting rampage, killing three people and wounding a child and two police officers, before being arrested by Special Operations police after an eight-hour siege.[7]
Quakers Hill Nursing Home Fire - 10 confirmed and as many as 21 people may have died as a result of a deliberately lit fire in a Quakers Hill nursing home. The fire was lit early on 18 November 2011.[8]
Cairns stabbings - A woman stabbed 8 children to death on Friday, 2014, December 19, 2014, 7 of them were her own.[9]
Murders over an extended period of time
Main article: List of Australian serial killers
Eric Edgar Cooke murdered 8 people between 1959 and 1963.
Backpacker murders - Ivan Milat killed seven international backpackers in the early 1990s, and is widely suspected of killing 30 more young adults.
Melbourne gangland killings - 36 underworld figures murdered so far in gang related violence between 1998 and 2010.
Snowtown murders - 12 murders committed from 1992 until 1999.
John Wayne Glover - murders of six elderly women on Sydney's North Shore over a fourteen month period in 1989-90
Truro murders - murders of seven women from 1976 until 1977
Miscellaneous
Whiskey Au Go Go fire - Fire lit in club killed 15
Douglas Crabbe - Truck driver deliberately crashed his truck into a hotel, killing five and badly wounding 16.
Russell Street Bombing - 23 wounded when a car bomb ignites outside a Police Building. One of the wounded, a female police officer, died later of injuries from the explosion.
Sydney Hilton bombing - Two garbage men were killed and 12 passers-by were injured by a bomb planted in a garbage bin outside the Sydney Hilton Hotel in 1978. A police officer who was wounded died later.
2014 Sydney hostage crisis - Two hostages and hostage-taker Man Haron Monis were killed, during a 16-hour siege inside a Lindt cafe in Martin Place, Sydney, with six other people injured.
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AUSTRALIA: MORE VIOLENT CRIME DESPITE GUN BAN
April 13, 2009
It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer. In 2002 -- five years after enacting its gun ban -- the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime. In fact, the percent of murders committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006 (16.3 percent), says the D.C. Examiner.
Even Australia's Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research acknowledges that the gun ban had no significant impact on the amount of gun-involved crime:
In 2006, assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
Moreover, Australia and the United States -- where no gun-ban exists -- both experienced similar decreases in murder rates:
Between 1995 and 2007, Australia saw a 31.9 percent decrease; without a gun ban, America's rate dropped 31.7 percent.
During the same time period, all other violent crime indices increased in Australia: assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
At the same time, U.S. violent crime decreased 31.8 percent: rape dropped 19.2 percent; robbery decreased 33.2 percent; aggravated assault dropped 32.2 percent.
Australian women are now raped over three times as often as American women.
While this doesn't prove that more guns would impact crime rates, it does prove that gun control is a flawed policy. Furthermore, this highlights the most important point: gun banners promote failed policy regardless of the consequences to the people who must live with them, says the Examiner.
Source: Howard Nemerov, "Australia experiencing more violent crime despite gun ban," Free Republic, April 9, 2009.
For text:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2225517/posts
In the UK, a recent survey of criminals in prison found that only 8% had ever owned an illegal firearm. So much for your statement that removing hand guns from civilians will result in all the criminals having them!
You ignore the simple fact that the gun control experiments have all been done, albeit not in the USA. The results are in, and we know that removing most guns, and pretty much all hand guns, from the general population, results in a major drop in murder rate. This is not an opinion. This is a fact, based on real life.
Again, the facts show that you are a fucking liar.
"Seth is Grandmaster Zen Troll who trains his victims to troll themselves every time they think of him" Robert_S
"All that is required for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke
"Those who support denying anyone the right to keep and bear arms for personal defense are fully complicit in every crime that might have been prevented had the victim been effectively armed." Seth
© 2013/2014/2015/2016 Seth, all rights reserved. No reuse, republication, duplication, or derivative work is authorized.
